MX Bikes Official Forum

I made one for b14 and b15, skipped b16 and now we're here, b17 launched.

Discord is not a good place to gather feedback and opinions, so we use the forum which makes way more sense for the players and PiBoSo.
When giving feedback please think about it beforehand, write constructive criticism, preferably a list like:

pros
-
-
cons
-
-
neutral
-
-
or take a look at my feedback back from beta14: http://forum.mx-bikes.com/index.php?topic=3389.msg38521#msg38521

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current changelog as of 02/02/22:
MX Bikes beta17 - 2022/2/1

Changelog:
fix: track layout custom objects collisions
fix: support for more than two controllers with the same name
fix: track paint in dedicated servers
fix: user interface lists sorting
fix: wrong missing category shown when trying to connect to a server
fix: missing team sprite
Fix: 3D names in the track screens
fix: missing right boot
new: option to enable only the L/R o F/B rider lean tracking
new: user interface pull-downs search box
new: servers browser name filter
new: number of pits in the track info
new: option to enable the environment sounds in the pit
new: option to show both 2D and 3D flags
new: particles when sliding on the ground
new: support for multiple rider models
new: supermoto rider model
new: wheelie standing animation

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let the hunger games begin

The new physics are horrible.. this game just went from a sim to arcade with this update.
im sure its just a bug but this new beta shouldn't have been released yet with how bad it is.
also cannot join any servers.
this new update has ruined the game, this is not just my solo opinion, everyone is saying the same thing.
dont take offence to this, this is real constructive criticism.
can you revert back to beta16 until you guys fix this one?
because this beta puts a halt on the entire game. no one can play or race with this update and all racing series will be affectedido

Quote from: Cooper526 on February 02, 2022, 02:26:42 PMThe new physics are horrible.. this game just went from a sim to arcade with this update.
im sure its just a bug but this new beta shouldn't have been released yet with how bad it is.
also cannot join any servers.
this new update has ruined the game, this is not just my solo opinion, everyone is saying the same thing.
dont take offence to this, this is real constructive criticism.
can you revert back to beta16 until you guys fix this one?
because this beta puts a halt on the entire game. no one can play or race with this update and all racing series will be affected.

You do know the things that would fix almost all of your issues?
Servers are not updated, players use old wheels, then there's players using new wheels trying to connect to an outdated server and vice versa.
Anything you said seems to be the known issues I also mentioned above.

Just to make it clear and no further discussion needed, please do the important steps first before expressing feedback.

last edit:
No offense but this is not constructive criticism saying revert everything back to beta 16. No mentions about the changes that have been made whatsoever. Just complains about user errors.

Quote from: Cooper526 on February 02, 2022, 02:26:42 PMThe new physics are horrible..
this new update has ruined the game, this is not just my solo opinion, everyone is saying the same thing.
dont take offence to this, this is real constructive criticism.

This is not constructive criticism, you are just giving your opinion on the physics with no effort to give an opinion on how to improve it, except "please revert." When you "tested" were you playing on the msm bike models, or were you using oems with/without tyre mods? Apart from the initial launch yesterday/last night the general opinion has turned more positive, due to people now knowing the oems are not perfected yet and the modded tyres are incorrect.

In my opinion the overall physics feel better, especially at slower speeds. I do agree that its still not perfect, for example when doing "oppos" the bike doesn't seem to rotate perfectly coming back. I also like having separated kit paint folders for different models.

A con/negative is the UI, it still feels too cluttered and compact, I don't see why it can't be separated and made to look better, like with how the UI mod by Insane has done. A mod shouldn't be needed to make it look better. (However I understand that this isn't a priority.)

*edit; the wind sounds seem to start when your at a lower speed now, which I find ok however maybe it's just a tiny bit too loud?

I tried beta 17 and the truth is that it works perfectly for me, passing the issue of skins, which is solved very easily, I loved the physics.
The bike has more inertia and is less bouncy.
I swear I don't know why everyone complains.

In general it is that.

My only problem now is that I can't get the custom character to work, which BTW, is a feature i been waiting for and im super happy about that.

Spent some time on Stock 250F and stock tires

1. Traction: There doesnt seem to be the level of traction in this beta as previous. Sliding out on berms is an issue. I noticed quite a bit of front end tuck but that could be because I have used the OEM's for so long that I am used to those bikes. Suspension setting could help with the front end tuck and I believe this is a user issue and not game related. The traction is lacking for sure.

2. The wind noise. It is distracting and is sometimes louder than the bike itself. Not so bad for the stock bike, but it is extreme when using the OEM's before this thread opened up. Its louder than the bike. Please remove or at least lower the volume of the wav file....a lot, or give the user the ability to modulate volume in the settings.

3. I have used the stock bike and tyres for all of my tracks and as a creator, if these stock bike power/rider/physics characteristics carried over to the OEM models after a fix, it would make my tracks redundant to the game as some obstacles are now hard to clear, some are not possible at all.

4. Could be placebo, but the Stock bikes in this beta feel more planted and less bouncy than previous. This is very welcome.

After riding with MSMs and no tire mods I have concluded.
- leaning back and forth does almost nothing (everything in this video is impossible now https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_R3qPyNb7FY  :-\
)
- it feels like a lot of skillful things that gave this game style have been taken away and everything feels sluggish
- wind noise is too much
- my biggest complaint is that the physics changes were things that no one wanted changed, and the stuff that people wanted changed (front tucking/slow physics) is still there. And the way to counter slow physics is knowing how to lean but now that doesn't work fast enough to save you.
- whole thing feels like a major step back  :'(

I find the feel of the new physics to be much more realistic as though the bike is now properly absorbing more thru it's suspension compared to the bounciness in previous beta versions. Also, really enjoying how the rear tire will break out when too much throttle's applied in a corner but it's more controllable.  As others have posted it's not perfect but a step in the right direction. After a few b17 update it will as right as rain ;) .

Quote from: pay2021 on February 02, 2022, 03:00:09 PMI tried beta 17 and the truth is that it works perfectly for me, passing the issue of skins, which is solved very easily, I loved the physics.
The bike has more inertia and is less bouncy.
I swear I don't know why everyone complains.

In general it is that.

My only problem now is that I can't get the custom character to work, which BTW, is a feature i been waiting for and im super happy about that.

I totally agree with you.

I find the physics much more consistent.

The bike absorbs bounces better and the front end tends to slide less for nothing.

I think the game is going in the right direction and as pay21 says I am surprised to see so many people complaining about the new update.

"Just don''t play with the mods until they are updated."

the only thing I noticed that felt different in a "what am I supposed to do" kind of way is that in air adjustments seem a little sluggish? Not sure if thats a me thing or an update thing. Maybe I just need to use a different technique now? I rode the OEM bikes(never had mod tires) and nothing weird happened. I was coming up short on some jumps but chalked that up to changes I haven't adjusted to, yet.

Idk if anyone else is having this problem. But whenever I updated it wont fully load into a track without crashing. Like it loads the rider, bike, and track but only for a second then it freezes and crashes. I tried it on the stock bikes and it does the same thing. But as of the update I can't actually play it :/

New physics Works just great. Traction is just litle bit of but More realistic than before. Not so bouncy and fromt wheel feels better. 250f's are as they should, u really need to keep Ur momentum and get out of those corners to clear The jumps. This is The way to go👍 just some adjustments.

I only rode OEM bikes

Got roughly 650 hrs in the game did a few laps in supercross with msm bike and no tyre mods.


Pros
- Absorbs bounces a lot better such as when landing slightly short on jumps,
- For turning, the front end is more predictable while the rear slides out more but in a controllable way in slower corners. So, I think the turning is a good improvement at slower corners. In faster corners the rear steps too much making it unpredictable and looks unnatural compared to the speed the bike is going. Another issue is also the rear step out too much when hitting jumps at angles.

Cons
- I can't tell if this is intentional or a bug but the front and back lean has minimal effect, wheeling is much more difficult to achieve, trying to maximize the effect of extending the bike to hit triples is reduced, and wheel tapping can't really be done now because it feels as if the bike wants to stay horizontal. Overall, the manoeuvrability of the bike is far less. In saying that though I think before the update it had too much manoeuvrability, a slight acceleration with a 0 swing-arm would cause wheeling, so I think somewhere in between would be good.
- This was an issue before the update but seems worse now and that is landing on the rear wheel when the front wheel is raised high and the bike is tilted, this makes the rear wheel act as if it's on ice crashing instantly.

Neutral
- More arcade like feel especially around corners.

The game physics are better, everything is better apart from not being able to load into online games, managed to get into 1 game which took 18mins to get in, just little things wrong but the actual riding physics are better, only thing i noticed was when you whip you sometimes can't bring it back with just the lean button

Also just noticed that the bike doesn't lift the front end anymore, like you can't lift the front wheel over bumps or even in mid air really now, it seems like the front end is super heavy or stuck to the ground which is causing rear traction to be lost, only noticed this when i changed to third person view, hope they fix that, its a bad issue

Quote from: garret_1197 on February 02, 2022, 07:46:23 PMIdk if anyone else is having this problem. But whenever I updated it wont fully load into a track without crashing. Like it loads the rider, bike, and track but only for a second then it freezes and crashes. I tried it on the stock bikes and it does the same thing. But as of the update I can't actually play it :/

Same, have you figured it out?

the community seems spit, I think people want the game to be better and hope updates fix that but this one doesn't seem like its goes in that direction, the pros physics wise seem like more cons then pros. hoping it gets better and the developers listen to the community   

Quote from: LxstBxysRxcing on February 03, 2022, 01:22:25 AM

Quote from: garret_1197 on February 02, 2022, 07:46:23 PMIdk if anyone else is having this problem. But whenever I updated it wont fully load into a track without crashing. Like it loads the rider, bike, and track but only for a second then it freezes and crashes. I tried it on the stock bikes and it does the same thing. But as of the update I can't actually play it :/

Same, have you figured it out?

Have you guys tried removing tyres from mod folder?

Summary of what I think and what I've heard in the discord:

Pros:

• Ground physics feel a lot more stable
• Traction is more realistic
• Slow physics have improved a lot

Cons:

• The air controls are very counterintuitive. To whip and do movements, you have to rider lean opposite of the way you would in real life. Here's an image showing it
  (https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/712432084928561282/938904733874290778/Screenshot_2022-02-03_123254.png)
• Consequently, oppo whips are now impossible with these changes
• Scrubbing is now irrelevant since you won't be able to bring it back. This makes the skill gap way smaller.

In summary, please make the in-air physics/controls more what they used to be in b16. The ground physics are nice, but the air controls feel entirely wrong.

I've removed the tyre mods and even MaxHUD and it still just crashes right when I go to track.

Overall to me everything is fine  8)
Don't even feel the differences in-air physics  ???

its not fun to play and I don't care if you have 50 hours or 2000 hours, is bad, landing is bad traction is bad, the 250 doesn't have any power or at least cant get it to the ground, witch makes 90% of the tracks no longer rideable, if you don't believe me try mantua. is not fun, I get it if your tryin got slow the game down but the slow physics are not good ether. the air physics are bad too. you would think with 80% of the community wanting the old physics back you should do something about it especially as this is pibosos most popular game. we need a fix. if your one of those people saying its not that bad stop lying to yourself, I get the developer's are trying but we shouldn't reward them with bad improvements.

Quote from: buzzcooksey on February 03, 2022, 11:14:38 PMI've removed the tyre mods and even MaxHUD and it still just crashes right when I go to track.

I took me having to wipe and reinstall the game to get in functioning again. Which is great! But the bike feels labored and struggle to make it over jumps I could easily clear before on the 350. In air physics change kind of sucks, but it is what it is. Bike just feels slow and really heavy. Even on the 450, it isn't any better. The new physics added and half a minute to my average lap times.

Ok, first off anybody saying that these physics are better, are most likely not on a pro level, so they do not feel the change as well as compared to a pro level mxb rider.

I have over 2000hrs on this game and i am at a pro level and here is my thoughts on the new update.

1. I noticed the The front end is a lot heavier which makes traction a lot better in the corners but also easier to wash the front end out while landing from a jump, which is not realistic in my opinion, if you lean back at the right time you should be able to take the load off the front, which you could in beta 16.. but now you cant.. if you could find a in between then that would be alot better.

2. Less Traction on the rear wheel is bad. If anything we needed more traction on the rear wheel. As a 450 rider i had perfect throttle control so i could corner perfect and also make it lose traction if i needed, now with beta 17 i feel as if i have no traction all the time... so there i think the old traction was better

3. The air physics are now opposite of what they should be, i know about the change in the assist during the air but i feel like the air physics before this update were perfect... beta 17 now i feel like the realistic feeling is gone and now it is all inverted. I think the old air physics are perfect and that the only thing that should be changed are the rider movement on the bike.. if you revert back to old air physics and changed the rider animation so the rider can lean more off the bike and take a leg off the peg on the side you whip, then you would have perfect air physics. So go back to old air physics.

4. The change in speed is very frustrating.. to me it already felt too slow and now it feels even slower. if anything i think it should have been sped up.

5. I love the wind effect. I am a 1st person rider and i really think the wind effect is awesome!

Overall: The traction is my main concern! It is unplayable the way it is now. We need more traction or revert back to beta16 traction.
Air physics also changed back or at least made realistic, at the moment the game doesn't feel like it used to and nothing feels right... very un realistic and honestly un playable.
I do not enjoy playing with beta17.

That is all i really care about. MX Bikes is the best mx game ever made and it still is.
This is coming from someone who played mx simulator since 2008.
When i discovered mx bikes i instantly converted because this game is beyond anything else.
I appreciate all the hard work you guys are putting into this game to make the best experience mx game ever.

So please all i say is listen to the community and mostly listen to what the pros have to say because they know the game better than anyone else!

I found this video on Youtube, he explains well what i mean about opposite air physics.

 

Thank you Piboso and the dev team for all that you do!

*Edit*

After spending more time playing i am really starting to like the changes! I actually like the traction now, it is alot more realistic. The air physics are still need alot of work and i know thats getting worked on. I tested out the beta17 air physics for hours and i can see some really good improvements but its just not there yet, a few more tweaks here and there and i can see it being really good. But playing with beta16 air physics and this new traction, i really do enjoy it.
As much as i enjoy the old air physics, i am excited on the new physics and cant wait to see future updates on this.

After giving it some time and practice i can really see the great work you have done. Thank you Piboso

Quote from: Form Forza on February 04, 2022, 06:33:04 AMits not fun to play and I don't care if you have 50 hours or 2000 hours, is bad, landing is bad traction is bad, the 250 doesn't have any power or at least cant get it to the ground, witch makes 90% of the tracks no longer rideable, if you don't believe me try mantua. is not fun, I get it if your tryin got slow the game down but the slow physics are not good ether. the air physics are bad too. you would think with 80% of the community wanting the old physics back you should do something about it especially as this is pibosos most popular game. we need a fix. if your one of those people saying its not that bad stop lying to yourself, I get the developer's are trying but we shouldn't reward them with bad improvements.

get good lol if you ride in irl do you not slide out on the dirt? Don't say you don't lol

Quote from: Rockchalice3875KTM on February 04, 2022, 04:52:42 PM

Quote from: Form Forza on February 04, 2022, 06:33:04 AMits not fun to play and I don't care if you have 50 hours or 2000 hours, is bad, landing is bad traction is bad, the 250 doesn't have any power or at least cant get it to the ground, witch makes 90% of the tracks no longer rideable, if you don't believe me try mantua. is not fun, I get it if your tryin got slow the game down but the slow physics are not good ether. the air physics are bad too. you would think with 80% of the community wanting the old physics back you should do something about it especially as this is pibosos most popular game. we need a fix. if your one of those people saying its not that bad stop lying to yourself, I get the developer's are trying but we shouldn't reward them with bad improvements.

get good lol if you ride in irl do you not slide out on the dirt? Don't say you don't lol

be quiet you fool. its idiots like you who say stupid things like this that are actually goons in the game and in real life...
next time comment something useful...

your comment was not needed. ignore these last two comments and look above at real constructive criticism.

Quote from: RACERX on February 04, 2022, 07:22:51 PM

Quote from: Rockchalice3875KTM on February 04, 2022, 04:52:42 PM

Quote from: Form Forza on February 04, 2022, 06:33:04 AMits not fun to play and I don't care if you have 50 hours or 2000 hours, is bad, landing is bad traction is bad, the 250 doesn't have any power or at least cant get it to the ground, witch makes 90% of the tracks no longer rideable, if you don't believe me try mantua. is not fun, I get it if your tryin got slow the game down but the slow physics are not good ether. the air physics are bad too. you would think with 80% of the community wanting the old physics back you should do something about it especially as this is pibosos most popular game. we need a fix. if your one of those people saying its not that bad stop lying to yourself, I get the developer's are trying but we shouldn't reward them with bad improvements.

get good lol if you ride in irl do you not slide out on the dirt? Don't say you don't lol

be quiet you fool. its idiots like you who say stupid things like this that are actually goons in the game and in real life...
next time comment something useful...

your comment was not needed. ignore these last two comments and look above at real constructive criticism.

you don't know me lmao Everyone is starting to get used to so can you. Get used it or don't play

Quote from: RACERX on February 04, 2022, 07:22:51 PM

Quote from: Rockchalice3875KTM on February 04, 2022, 04:52:42 PM

Quote from: Form Forza on February 04, 2022, 06:33:04 AMits not fun to play and I don't care if you have 50 hours or 2000 hours, is bad, landing is bad traction is bad, the 250 doesn't have any power or at least cant get it to the ground, witch makes 90% of the tracks no longer rideable, if you don't believe me try mantua. is not fun, I get it if your tryin got slow the game down but the slow physics are not good ether. the air physics are bad too. you would think with 80% of the community wanting the old physics back you should do something about it especially as this is pibosos most popular game. we need a fix. if your one of those people saying its not that bad stop lying to yourself, I get the developer's are trying but we shouldn't reward them with bad improvements.

get good lol if you ride in irl do you not slide out on the dirt? Don't say you don't lol

be quiet you fool. its idiots like you who say stupid things like this that are actually goons in the game and in real life...
next time comment something useful...

your comment was not needed. ignore these last two comments and look above at real constructive criticism.

if other people are getting used to it so can you lol stop bitching about it.

After playing some times the new beta feels great overall.

There is just some things I noticed :

- Lean tracking seems to block both L/R and F/B, no matter which one we are choosing.

- Bike inertia in the air when approching "straight axis" feels locked, almost like the bike can't go the other way (In real life, rider lean is very useful before takeoff to throw the bike sideways, but intertia makes it come back "alone". Except when throwing huge whips, rider has its importance to make it come back good).
When now I feel we need to lean with the rider to make the bike come back that little extra that makes it really straight before landing.

- I don't know if F/B lean has been touched, or it is because of new tyre values, but seat bouncing seems impossible, or really really non efficient compared to what it should be. F/B lean doesn't bother me really in other aspect of riding.

- I don't know if it's been reported, but race data/terrain deformation is insanely huge when loading into a server (not for servers with less than 5 people and open practice sessions).





SIDE NOTES (not necessarily B17 related) :
- I am still asking for "rider in front" gap on the pitboard, added to currently rider behind gap ideally.

- Having a search bar for tracks would be cool

- When having unlinked brakes, I can still rear brake "two" times in the air, like front brake input also push the rear brake.
( it goes with seat bouncing problem, seat bouncing and then releasing front lean while taping rear brake should make the bike "nose dive" a lot, I feel like it is limited even more with b17)

- Lastly, I don't think "only listening to pro" is a good thing, a lot of the fastest riders in the game are using unrealistic features of the game that make them go that fast. The argument "we are slower so it's unrealistic" should not exist, a game is not realistic because we go fast, overall feeling and matching irl laptimes with irl track scale is a great way to see if the games tends to be realistic or not, imo. Barely using the rider weight around the bike is not something realistic that needed to change.

Here are my 2 cents after playing since the update,

Pros:
1. I like the confidence in lateral traction. I've found with a good line I seem to have better traction and was able to be smoother. I felt in B16 you had less confidence throughout some corners and would have the front end washing out more when I would push as compared to B17.
2. Saving swaps seem to be more efficient. I have gotten pretty sideways and was able to bring the bike back whereas in B16 it was more of a switch where it was either savable or a crash.
3. Overall control of the bike seems improved and more stable.

Cons:
1. Air physics are not as satisfying as B16. BUT it is not impossible to whip. I do prefer the air physics in B16 as they allowed you to throw the bike around like how you would like instead of having an invisible force limiting your movements. And having to turn into the whip to bring it back is so strange and hard to adapt to.

I was upset that I lost all my control presets when B17 updated, but after some trial and error it is playable. No I don't think it is as satisfying to play like B16, but it also could of been a lot worse. 

The main issue now is that it's nearly impossible to join any online session.

After 17c update. The game either crashes or stays stuck syncing forever. It has taken me hours to join a session.

Updates after b16 have made online playing very difficult

Quote from: Oggpeg on February 06, 2022, 11:59:34 AMThe main issue now is that it's nearly impossible to join any online session.

After 17c update. The game either crashes or stays stuck syncing forever. It has taken me hours to join a session.

Updates after b16 have made online playing very difficult

Yupp same here.

Another 1 for revert to Beta16 traction.

Everything else feels great.

Unless someone can magically rescale every track so you don't have to be a pro 250 rider to clear jumps again. IDC how hard or easy the game is I just want to have fun on it, and I no longer do. Would be happy playing the beta16 version alone for eternity.

If anyone is aware of a way to revert back to Beta16 ide love to know about it.

After taking plenty of time to actually get used to the changes before slamming them for just feeling unfamiliar like so many others have, I'll give my 2 cents on the update.

Air Controls:
Many have said that the B17 air physics are harder to control, inverted or even just unusable, and I wholeheartedly disagree. If you think the air controls are unresponsive, you can't bring back whips and scrubs or think rider lean is inverted, sorry but you need to get gud.
The way rider lean affects the bike in the air did not change for B17, so if you understood how it worked before you probably won't have a problem. But if you're used to relying on bike lean instead of rider lean then B17 probably makes the bike feel unresponsive because bike lean no longer does anything in the air (nor should it). You may have tried using rider lean to adapt, but with hundreds of hours controlling the bike the wrong way it will take time to break old habits and relearn air control. It will feel unfamiliar, you'll probably think it's inverted, you will probably think the update is bad because you aren't as good as you were before, then you'll say the update should be reverted because you were impatient and didn't take time to learn properly. If this sounds like you, git gud and keep reading.

L/R rider lean in the air is not inverted, your perspective of it is. It controls the bike the same way F/B rider lean does. Leaning forward actually brings the front up because the rider pulls on the bars to lean forward. Leaning one way will always push the bars the opposite way. It's Newton's 3rd Law, equal and opposite reactions. The same applies with L/R lean. Rider leans left, he pushes bike to the right and vice versa. That's why when you do a whip steering left, leaning rider to the right makes it bigger (pushing the bars further left makes the rear swing further right) and leaning rider left again brings it back (pushing the bars back to the right straightens the bike). The same applies for scrubs.
Once you understand this the air controls become a lot more intuitive, and with practice you will probably have better control than before.
All that said, unfortunately the rider F/B lean is about 50% weaker than before because the assist basically doubled both rider lean axes. That is my only real gripe with the new controls, but I'm sure this will be adjusted in the future. The physics also need an update to fix the weird air gyro/momentum and 360 bug (this is why oppos don't work anymore. The gyro was never perfect but the assist was strong enough to overpower it.)

Traction/ground physics:
I think the traction changes are a big improvement, mainly because we had way too much traction before, but paired with the improved ground physics sliding feels much more natural and predictable. You can slide the rear into corners more predictably making steering with your rear a possibility, which I love. Ruts are also more predictable because you tend to slide back into them instead of climbing up the inside or outside edge, which I love. Throttle control is much more important than before, which I love. Sand also feels much more like sand (albeit very loose sand), which I love.

The only con with the ground physics is higher powered bikes are kind of crippled by the reduction of traction, and I think that's mostly down to the the large gap in amount of grip before and after you break traction. It's kind of hard to explain, but you look at this graph, the red line is how it feels now, and the blue line is more what I think it should feel like.
Basically it should be easier to break traction, but once you do you shouldn't lose so much. The way it is now kind of feels like tarmac or hard pack where you lose almost all traction once you break it, but soft soils there should be a smaller jump in traction level because the tyre digs into the dirt even when it's spinning or sliding. The softer or looser a soil is the easier it should be to break traction, but the less traction you should lose once you do imo. I'm sure this wouldn't be easy to simulate properly, but that's what I think we should aim for.

TL,DR: If you can't handle new air controls, get gud it's not broken. Lean isn't inverted, you're just thinking about it wrong. Ground physics are better. Traction is improved but could be much better. Update definitely shouldn't be reverted, it should be tuned and built upon.

I've spent a good few hours in testing with MSM bikes and all tyre mods removed... since the b16 air controls are restored the ride is fine at speed, but low speed physics are killin' me.  I ride in VR, with no assists (not even clutch assist) and after being spun around so many times in 1st person VR i had to watch the replay to see what exactly is going on with the slow speed.  This clip shows a "high speed" wreck and the low speed mess up im experiencing.  in each, it seems like the front suspension will fully compress and rebound for some reason.  check it out:  https://youtu.be/EGhBd-tZF5o