Edit--
Nevermind. Good luck with futher development of this game Piboso team. Love the work so far.
To start off, I'm not defending MXB down to the ground here without thinking as I think any physics issues should be highlighted but I think a couple of things I've noticed need pointing out..
The first one mainly being the collision surfaces. Right now the only collision surfaces available for 3d objects that are relevant here are concrete, asphalt, kerb and soil. Starting with the logs, wooden logs have a very unique physics behavior in that they have give to them, they move even if only slightly when stacked up, they have flexibility and depending on what type of log probably more grip than any of the aforementioned surface types.
Tyres are even more impossible to simulate here. Compared to concrete, asphalt etc.. they have a HUGE amount of give and flexibility, even big hard tough tractor tyres. There's no way you could expect them to behave like tyres using one of the above collisions. I'm also not sure if you're using the TYRE WLL collision whether it would give you something rideable as it's intended to be used as a wall..
Bottom line is, there's no system in place to simulate riding on logs or tyres.
Again, not defending MXB without thinking, it just stands to reason to me that right now you shouldn't expect this track to work at all. Still, a fun project, and looking forward to the days where something like this might be possible! Would be interested to hear PiBoSo's take on it.
Quote from: geofanatec on July 25, 2016, 12:16:09 AM
Seriously again!
You come in here to say this is why you quit MXB? Over this bullshit!!
Seriously!!!!!
MXS can't handle it!
And the u go on to say how a dirt bike should handle!!! With this BS track?
Your making the impossible and expecting real results! Not MXB or MXS can handle this stupid crap.
Edit: 99.99% of riders on a real bike couldn't even do this crap!
And you expect it to be a real phsyic test?
Again? I can't remember doing this before.
MXS actually can handle this.
This isn't a 'track' as I said before... This is just a 'map' with all different kind of stuff on it to tests things out.
Stop getting angry at everything I say Geo. You act like a 15 year old imho.
Quote from: geofanatec on July 25, 2016, 12:59:07 AM
Imho your insane!
You expect the impossible to be possible.
And so you quit!
Ya good attitude
No I'm not. I'm just expecting a motocross game where you can actually ride enduro cross.
I'm sorry I'm trying to point out things and help further development. I know this is a work in progress game, and that Piboso has a lot other stuff to do, but if noone points these things out he might not even think about it and then the game will never be what it could be by looking at what Piboso can do.
I dont have the time to make any 'shit' at the moment.
Judging by the message before the edit, your name is missing a "t" ;D
I thought I made some pretty good points Sand, but I guess you'd rather not discuss it?
Quote from: TheFatController on July 25, 2016, 10:26:08 AM
I thought I made some pretty good points Sand, but I guess you'd rather not discuss it?
You made some pretty good points yes. But Geo just pisses me off every single time I post something.
I still think it should work better if it was concrete or asphalt or anything like that. Heck, you can even climb up rocks if you're good at extreme enduro IRL.
I really don't understand why everyone hates me here. I'm not hating on this game, I like it so far. But there are things that need to be improved. If noone will mention this, it might never get improved. I'm just pointing things out which should be worked on. I'm sorry for actually trying to help the development. Why am I the bitter one for actually giving feedback and help try to improve a beta version of a game? Isn't a beta suposed to have testers, people giving feedback to improve it.
I'm not hating. I like this game.
Tbh, you came accross as bitter because of the tone, not the content.
I also think physics have a long way to go but quite frankly, and from having attempted stuff like that, enduro / trial / obstacle courses rely so much on precise 3D movement, clutch, rear brake and throttle control that I am not sure we have enough analog sticks on a controller to actually do it without simulated help - which PiBoSo refuses to do.
Plus, and more importantly, there are still some basic MX behaviour that are lacking (rider and bike lean not working together being the main one, plus tire / ground deformation interaction). I'd rather fix those first than look into why we can't tire tap 3 logs in a row. Small secure steps before trying to leap forward would help solidify the core game.
Well, I'm sorry for for sounding a little pissed off. But really every time I try to help I get hate from it. Geo actually replied with 14 exclamation marks in one post, which was an even worse tone than anything I've done so far.
This test wasn't just about the logs. But just a physics test. I thought Piboso might've found this helpfull to improve physics in small steps or maybe even find bugs.
It's hard to follow the discussion without the original message.
It seems that there was a track to stress-test the physics. Would it be possible to have a download link?
Quote from: PiBoSo on July 25, 2016, 10:52:38 AM
It's hard to follow the discussion without the original message.
It seems that there was a track to stress-test the physics. Would it be possible to have a download link?
Currently there are just some logs, tires and sharp edged ruts models. I'll be adding more later.
Download link:
http://www.mediafire.com/download/o9ip6451t1qdd1a/test.rar
I also talked about being able to wheelie through bumpy corners like in this video at around 0.18.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sKiVK0YJhQI
I know the game is still in development and there are probably other things that need to be done first. But keeping these things in mind might help everything out a little more when working on the physics.
Quote from: Sandbiter on July 25, 2016, 10:37:29 AM
Quote from: TheFatController on July 25, 2016, 10:26:08 AM
I thought I made some pretty good points Sand, but I guess you'd rather not discuss it?
You made some pretty good points yes. But Geo just pisses me off every single time I post something.
I still think it should work better if it was concrete or asphalt or anything like that. Heck, you can even climb up rocks if you're good at extreme enduro IRL.
I really don't understand why everyone hates me here. I'm not hating on this game, I like it so far. But there are things that need to be improved. If noone will mention this, it might never get improved. I'm just pointing things out which should be worked on. I'm sorry for actually trying to help the development. Why am I the bitter one for actually giving feedback and help try to improve a beta version of a game? Isn't a beta suposed to have testers, people giving feedback to improve it.
I'm not hating. I like this game.
(http://www.amothersthoughts.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/02/Vagisil.jpg)
Quote from: Sandbiter on July 25, 2016, 10:58:19 AM
Quote from: PiBoSo on July 25, 2016, 10:52:38 AM
It's hard to follow the discussion without the original message.
It seems that there was a track to stress-test the physics. Would it be possible to have a download link?
Currently there are just some logs, tires and sharp edged ruts models. I'll be adding more later.
Download link:
http://www.mediafire.com/download/o9ip6451t1qdd1a/test.rar
I also talked about being able to wheelie through bumpy corners like in this video at around 0.18.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sKiVK0YJhQI
I know the game is still in development and there are probably other things that need to be done first. But keeping these things in mind might help everything out a little more when working on the physics.
Thank you.
Have the objects the TRK or the WLL prefix?
The tyres have no grip on WLL surfaces.
Quote from: PiBoSo on July 25, 2016, 11:41:08 AM
Quote from: Sandbiter on July 25, 2016, 10:58:19 AM
Quote from: PiBoSo on July 25, 2016, 10:52:38 AM
It's hard to follow the discussion without the original message.
It seems that there was a track to stress-test the physics. Would it be possible to have a download link?
Currently there are just some logs, tires and sharp edged ruts models. I'll be adding more later.
Download link:
http://www.mediafire.com/download/o9ip6451t1qdd1a/test.rar
I also talked about being able to wheelie through bumpy corners like in this video at around 0.18.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sKiVK0YJhQI
I know the game is still in development and there are probably other things that need to be done first. But keeping these things in mind might help everything out a little more when working on the physics.
Thank you.
Have the objects the TRK or the WLL prefix?
The tyres have no grip on WLL surfaces.
I'll have a look later today. I might even add some more stuff.
Here it is. Every log and tire has now TRKCONC. It works better now.
Quote from: Sandbiter on July 25, 2016, 11:04:55 PM
Here it is. Every log and tire has now TRKCONC. It works better now.
If there are enough requests the rubber and wood materials can be added as rideable surfaces, in the future.
Quote from: PiBoSo on July 25, 2016, 11:40:41 PM
Quote from: Sandbiter on July 25, 2016, 11:04:55 PM
Here it is. Every log and tire has now TRKCONC. It works better now.
If there are enough requests the rubber and wood materials can be added as rideable surfaces, in the future.
That'd be great. Thanks a lot.
I forgot the download link to the updated 'track' in my last post.
Here it is:
http://www.mediafire.com/download/o9ip6451t1qdd1a/test.rar
Quote from: geofanatec on July 28, 2016, 01:32:18 AM
Sandy (that's your new name).
So does this mean we might actually see you active in the sim?
Or is it still not good enough? :)
Just teasing, but would like more competition out there participating. Figured it's a long shot (mainly because perfection doesn't exist), BUT maybe you will join in?
Might be yes. I've a lot of fun since I figured out the 1st first person camera is awesome.
I also have some great ideas for tracks, but I never finish stuff like that. I don't know why. I might just update archview though.
I think if you want the community to grow you need to finish tracks. Even if they're not to your liking, you can always release a v2 later on, it gives the community hope.
Honestly, if everyone who's started to show a track and then not followed it up had made at least 2 tracks each in the 2 ish years we've had this sim available (not unreasonable) we'd probably have over 15 additional tracks. Regardless of quality it's progression. It's ALL this sim needs right now..
I also don't but into the physics issues stopping people. There's nothing we can do to fix problems in between betas, in fact by making tracks and riding more and encouraging more participation we may be able to provide better feedback and more sales for PiBoSo, resulting in more funding for the developer, can't be a bad thing to promote development of a beta that we all bought in to..
I don't understand anyone who doesn't get this mentalty, sorry..
Not 100% directed at you there 'Sandy' (lol geo) more of a generic rant ;)
I'm kind of a perfectionist. If I don't like it, I won't release it. It's not something I'm proud of and people will remember me for making bad content.
I know it shouldn't really bother me at this stage of the game. I need to release something to help grow this community.
Also remember that feedback will drive you to do better next time!
If you're making tracks for the community and feedback is good, people like your work and have more tracks to ride, that's all that really matters :)
That's a fair point sand but sadly shit content is better than no content. People remember you specifically as "the dude who never releases" instead of the dude who is trying.
To elaborate on Fats point, yeah I too don't buy into the physics putting people off, however I know that the steering/leaning is an issue for slot of guys. Like anything though, get used to it and it's a lot of fun.
I must of had at least 3 or 4 guys message me to say they bought mxb simply from watching my videos on YouTube, they had no idea the game existed. So at least the videos are doing their job.. Now the problem with the videos, content. Just not enough new content to keep people interested, including me. After 100000 hours on the practice track etc it just gets old. The biggest appeal for me about mxs is the shear numbers of tracks to download, literally 100s. I'd love to see and influx of creators and hopefully (we say it before every beta release) the next beta will attract more creators.
I bought mxb because of you tube. I then battled the physics and my patience but now I am more than satisfied and know it will get even better!
Sand-
Regarding your enduro-cross track attempts and physics issues.. I personally love that you are trying to make that work as I am very interested in that kind of riding. I would have to say, mxb may not be ready for 1/1 simulation of a trials/enduro x.. but I actually found some of your obstacles leaving me with excitement that it is actually possible with the current beta! I think the trick(for now) would be to sink the obstacles a bit more into the dirt and spread them out some. For example the tires that are laying flat would possibly have to just be removed until later beta or do them in rows of two with some dirt between and maybe some dirt helping you ride up onto them.. The big set of tires that are standing needs a little booster ramp of dirt on each side etc etc.. maybe in the future go extreme but for now, just make it work! it would be fun and hard all in the same.
If you were to take an enduro trail like my track or piboso's enduro and put the logs that you put in your track, it would make some neat obstacles as is. So I am pretty sure this is doable until more people convince piboso to make this any kind of priority. If you ever want someone to test that kind of thing, hola!
Piboso, +1 on rubber/wood! **enduro-cross was actually a big hit on MX vs ATV series.
Bringing this thread back to live after 3+ years. I downloaded and tested Ruben's test track - yeah, pretty unrideable. The bike just bounces around when it contacts any of the tires. I'm not sure if this is because it is an old test from previous betas that doesn't work in the current one. It seems like if all of these objects were set to concrete then it should work okay. On Mantua, I'm able to hit all of the concrete curbs and walls and even pop up them enduro style pretty easily. Would love to have some better physics to fix this for more obstacles.
Quote from: ResoluteKraken on December 15, 2019, 07:41:49 AMBringing this thread back to live after 3+ years. I downloaded and tested Ruben's test track - yeah, pretty unrideable. The bike just bounces around when it contacts any of the tires. I'm not sure if this is because it is an old test from previous betas that doesn't work in the current one. It seems like if all of these objects were set to concrete then it should work okay. On Mantua, I'm able to hit all of the concrete curbs and walls and even pop up them enduro style pretty easily. Would love to have some better physics to fix this for more obstacles.
I've recently tried another endurocross style track, all objects were TRKSOIL, aka soil. It had the same exact effect as the track in the first post. Maybe this has to do with the sharp edge bug we experience on terrain these days.
I don't know what collisions Snappe has used on Mantua, but I do think they're WLLCONC, aka concrete walls, which means that the bike has 0 traction on them as far as I know.
It has to be the sharp edge bug then - You can literally just bounce around in the tires like a ping pong ball on mousetraps. Interesting if the they are WLLCONC on Mantua - they seem to have sharp edges but you can ride up to them slow, pop the clutch and wheelie up and over almost like a perfect double-blip move.
Just to update this thread for Beta 14 - TRK objects still don't act correctly when used on objects like logs and rocks. Re-tested Ruben's test track that uses TRKCONC and you still bounce off the objects unrealistically. On Erzberg, I tested TRKSOIL rocks - same thing. It is not like Beta 13 or earlier ones were you would be shot to space, but still unrideable. I've gone back to WLLCONC for my rocks which act as they should except for the lack of as much traction and the fact that if you have a large WLL object and try to ride on top of it you will start to tilt over to the side.