MX Bikes Official Forum

General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: on January 01, 1970, 01:00:00 AM

Poll
Question: How do you like the new physics?
Option 1: Perfect votes: 8
Option 2: Better than before but still needs work votes: 35
Option 3: I can't really tell what's different votes: 6
Option 4: Worse than before votes: 12
Option 5: Unrideable votes: 2
Title: MX Bikes beta14 - Phyiscs Poll
Post by: iNsane on April 06, 2020, 02:50:18 PM
Hello everyone,
as the Discord is getting flooded with a lot spamming between actual feedbacks, we thought about doing a poll about how you all like or dislike the new changes for both bike behaviour and physics in general.

If you voted for something, please mention what your option was and write a little explanation what you think feels different.

Please note that you should ONLY give feedback considering the use of the STOCK MSM bikes. Current OEM bikes are rideable, but they are not updated to the new changes of the game engine, so please keep that in mind.
Title: Re: MX Bikes beta14 - Phyiscs Poll
Post by: iNsane on April 06, 2020, 02:54:57 PM
I'll start as always

Option: Great Improvement

In my opinion and after riding the MSM 250xf for around 3 hours and playing around with the camera settings (both locked, unlocked; changing the FOV/pitch/...) I started to really like the new physics and bike behaviour in general. Whips feel awesome, the bouncyness got way better, if you case a jump you actually get punished for it and your front washes out/you fall. In b13c it was really forgiving if you case jumps but this wasn't the real deal, IMO.

Cornering feels great too, I still can try to drag bars but you have to get used to the fact that you can't rocket out of a corner anymore really. The grip has been a bit reduced which makes the game feel greatly better and more realistic. The usage of rider weight became a very important task to do when trying to get fast, this is great.
Title: Re: MX Bikes beta14 - Phyiscs Poll
Post by: StoneRider on April 06, 2020, 02:57:58 PM
i think it is a great improvement. I love the feeling of the new suspension, i love the modifications made to the lean and rider movements. the new grip also feels way more accurate, and i'm glad that braking feels like we are riding in actual dirt. i also love the fact that we can't launch an insane jump, land flat and be fine anymore. suspensions feels way more realistic. in my opinion, this is a big step forward.
Title: Re: MX Bikes beta14 - Phyiscs Poll
Post by: YooHazy|HM on April 06, 2020, 04:36:11 PM
after playing around and getting a setup and messing w a few things on the msms the whips physics are amazing but IMO the old physics are ALOT better. with the new physics you cant really "over jump" anything without washing the front wheel even if you barley over jump something. i feel as we should keep the new whip physics but bring back the old bike and rider physics from beta 13.
Title: Re: MX Bikes beta14 - Phyiscs Poll
Post by: Grimoire on April 06, 2020, 05:19:58 PM
alot of good improvements on beta 14 but i must say i liked beta 13 more alot of rough tracks feel weird now cause you're so glued to the ground and the rider is alot stiffer now if you ride 1st person that doesn't really matter but i don't want to ride 1st person all the time another thing that happens alot more is sliding out of corners im not even that hard on the throttle but i slide out very easily which kinda takes the fun away for me but i will still keep playing it cause i just love this game way too much but i hope it gets abit more looser again in next patches
Title: Re: MX Bikes beta14 - Phyiscs Poll
Post by: Niko Mouk on April 06, 2020, 06:03:29 PM
Personally I checked that I can't tell what's different as I don't have a sufficient level to say if it's better or worse.
Title: Re: MX Bikes beta14 - Phyiscs Poll
Post by: Resolute Kraken on April 06, 2020, 06:56:49 PM
Option: Great Improvement

I've mostly tested on my WIP Erzberg track - which brings out the worst in the slow speed physics and handling on hills.  I was able to immediately notice an improvement of the suspension.  When the rear end starts to swap on a tough climb it is now possible to save it in some cases.  The oscillation of the front end when hitting small bumps on hills is better now - not perfect but better.

TRKSOIL rock objects don't shoot you to the moon now, but the collision simulation with them is still not realistic.
Title: Re: MX Bikes beta14 - Phyiscs Poll
Post by: Big Smooth one3 on April 06, 2020, 08:25:06 PM
"I don't like it, it feels horrible" - not a great response option IMO, it's kind of 2 responses. I'd like to put "I don't like/love it" but I'm not trying to say "it feels horrible."

Anyway, the OJ front end washout - and front end washout in general - is a sizable put-off for me so far. I'm trying hard to not be "that guy" etc., but not really enjoying b14 gameplay when compared to b13, which I thought was a gigantic leap from the last time I'd played MXB (and the reason I finally dove into track making). Right now it just feels like it's reverted back to being a bit wonky, which I know isn't a defined point of feedback specific to a single item, but it's a feeling. A lot of it is the random-seeming front end wash, almost like I have no feeling for when it's going to happen or isn't, it just does. Also, the bike feels really heavy maybe? Or like my rider has popped a few muscle relaxers and can't react quickly enough...Idk, it's just sluggish. Oddly though, when running a few laps on some of my sx tracks, the bike also feels kind of floaty, which doesn't make sense with a feeling of heaviness...it's just...it's really strange, I don't know enough about the inner workings and variables at play to define it down to a single point, I guess.

Anyway, I know that I'm no expert with this game nor have I been around here nearly as long as most, so I can only provide my "feeling" input/feedback. The largest take away thus far, the one if I were in charge of this operation that I'd be most concerned with, is that it's just not as fun as it was - again, I know, not overly descriptive, but nonetheless accurate from my experience. Glad to see others enjoying it so much, that's awesome. Just because I'm not loving it doesn't mean it's bad, if I stopped playing it wouldn't make an ounce of difference (nor should it), so please understand I'm only trying to provide honest information from my personal point of view.
Title: Re: MX Bikes beta14 - Phyiscs Poll
Post by: iNsane on April 06, 2020, 08:28:15 PM
Thanks Smooth, I've changed the options. Hope it's more clear now.
Title: Re: MX Bikes beta14 - Phyiscs Poll
Post by: CBM Racing on April 06, 2020, 11:02:15 PM
Quote from: Big Smooth one3 on April 06, 2020, 08:25:06 PM"I don't like it, it feels horrible" - not a great response option IMO, it's kind of 2 responses. I'd like to put "I don't like/love it" but I'm not trying to say "it feels horrible."

Anyway, the OJ front end washout - and front end washout in general - is a sizable put-off for me so far. I'm trying hard to not be "that guy" etc., but not really enjoying b14 gameplay when compared to b13, which I thought was a gigantic leap from the last time I'd played MXB (and the reason I finally dove into track making). Right now it just feels like it's reverted back to being a bit wonky, which I know isn't a defined point of feedback specific to a single item, but it's a feeling. A lot of it is the random-seeming front end wash, almost like I have no feeling for when it's going to happen or isn't, it just does. Also, the bike feels really heavy maybe? Or like my rider has popped a few muscle relaxers and can't react quickly enough...Idk, it's just sluggish. Oddly though, when running a few laps on some of my sx tracks, the bike also feels kind of floaty, which doesn't make sense with a feeling of heaviness...it's just...it's really strange, I don't know enough about the inner workings and variables at play to define it down to a single point, I guess.

Anyway, I know that I'm no expert with this game nor have I been around here nearly as long as most, so I can only provide my "feeling" input/feedback. The largest take away thus far, the one if I were in charge of this operation that I'd be most concerned with, is that it's just not as fun as it was - again, I know, not overly descriptive, but nonetheless accurate from my experience. Glad to see others enjoying it so much, that's awesome. Just because I'm not loving it doesn't mean it's bad, if I stopped playing it wouldn't make an ounce of difference (nor should it), so please understand I'm only trying to provide honest information from my personal point of view.

I agree to a point. I am happy they changed the suspension because in Beta 13 it was so bouncy I could actually do a bunny hop which unless you are on a trials bike should not be possible. But in Beta 14 they made the suspension so stiff no matter how much you try to soften it. They just went from one extreme to another instead they should have met in the middle. Not every person is ready to ride such stiff suspension just like if I threw 99.9% of you on my buddies Factory Race bike for Supercross you wouldn't even be able to ride it around a track no matter how slow you went. Its meant for Tomac speed where anything but the stiffest suspension can't handle how fast he hits the faces of jumps and the whoops. If they could soften the suspension up a bit I think it would be so much better.
Title: Re: MX Bikes beta14 - Phyiscs Poll
Post by: CBM Racing on April 06, 2020, 11:07:19 PM
I think you should add what skill level these people are at that are voting. Anyone that has been with this game through multiple Betas seems to really like the new Beta 14 anyone that bought it when it released on Steam seems to feel the opposite and I understand. I remember when this game first came out so yes Beta 14 is a HUGE improvement but I think there are a lot of new Riders that only played Beta 13 like myself and now they were hit with a major change that makes it harder for the people trying to learn so I can see the frustrations. Some kind of steering stabilizer could go a long way if that is possible to incorporate into the game and not as a mod make it part of the next revision of Beta 14.
Title: Re: MX Bikes beta14 - Phyiscs Poll
Post by: Nicky Locke on April 07, 2020, 04:42:48 AM
I agree with Hazy. I think some of the stuff he did was a move forward such as taking care of the "bounciness" and random explosions, but as far as the riding physics go I really enjoyed beta 13 a lot more. I felt like I had a lot more bike control into corners, I could over jump something a little bit and not have to worry, and it just all around felt better in my opinion. I know you have to adapt to changes but after hundreds of hours learning a style to suit yourself, hundreds of hours relearning just doesnt seem very entertaining. These are just my opinion, Ive only been playing since Beta 13 so im clueless of the game before, but after it doesnt feel like the same game
Title: Re: MX Bikes beta14 - Phyiscs Poll
Post by: Asdrael on April 07, 2020, 09:16:42 AM
CBM has a point, it's mostly the newer people having a problem with the physics change. The "vets" have seen so many changes, we just ride them out and try to provide objective feedback because this is still an early access beta.

Sorry to say it again but b13 was easy mode. Grip was way too high, hell you could lean with brakes fully on with no issues and you couldn't even get a proper wheel spin with a race start. Now you have to balance your weight and play with the bike throttle and brakes more carefully to keep the grip... Is it perfect? I don't think so. Is it more fun and realistic than before? Hell yeah.

Hoh and check your bike setup, the stock bikes have awful stock setup.
Title: Re: MX Bikes beta14 - Phyiscs Poll
Post by: Paradox28 on April 07, 2020, 11:05:56 PM
I'm just really struggling with the random front end knifing in corners that seems to just...happen, as well. I have no problems with the rest but every time I come to a corner, I'm wondering if its just gonna knife or if I can take the corner. I have been playing since around b3/4 and felt like even if b13 was "easy mode" the ability to ride aggressively was nice compared to not knowing what the bike was going to do. I'm not at an expert level riding in this game, for reference
Title: Re: MX Bikes beta14 - Phyiscs Poll
Post by: Nicky Locke on April 07, 2020, 11:28:26 PM
Quote from: Asdrael on April 07, 2020, 09:16:42 AMCBM has a point, it's mostly the newer people having a problem with the physics change. The "vets" have seen so many changes, we just ride them out and try to provide objective feedback because this is still an early access beta.

Sorry to say it again but b13 was easy mode. Grip was way too high, hell you could lean with brakes fully on with no issues and you couldn't even get a proper wheel spin with a race start. Now you have to balance your weight and play with the bike throttle and brakes more carefully to keep the grip... Is it perfect? I don't think so. Is it more fun and realistic than before? Hell yeah.

Hoh and check your bike setup, the stock bikes have awful stock setup.

Do you have a decent setup that youd be willing to share with me?
Title: Re: MX Bikes beta14 - Phyiscs Poll
Post by: KL4U55 on April 08, 2020, 12:11:58 PM
Quote from: Asdrael on April 07, 2020, 09:16:42 AMCBM has a point, it's mostly the newer people having a problem with the physics change. The "vets" have seen so many changes, we just ride them out and try to provide objective feedback because this is still an early access beta.

Sorry to say it again but b13 was easy mode. Grip was way too high, hell you could lean with brakes fully on with no issues and you couldn't even get a proper wheel spin with a race start. Now you have to balance your weight and play with the bike throttle and brakes more carefully to keep the grip... Is it perfect? I don't think so. Is it more fun and realistic than before? Hell yeah.

Hoh and check your bike setup, the stock bikes have awful stock setup.

I agree with you Asdrael, before the rider ingame act like was in asphalt, much grip to almost touch the bar everytime doing a lean.
Now negative curves like Winchester needs to be in right gear and working more with body, less with bike lean itself, great feeling as caution irl.
Although 450xf and 350xf seems too dangerous rn... excessive spinning in the back wheel forcing you drop rpm to much lower after the apex. 250xf doing fine at this. Keep it up PiBoSo!
Title: Re: MX Bikes beta14 - Phyiscs Poll
Post by: AMAX816 on April 09, 2020, 04:14:11 AM
Like others, I too am having issues with the front end washing out. I only have a few hundred hours in, so compared to most on the board I guess I would fall into the category of "noob".  :)

It actually seems ok until I burn through the first few layers of soft soil...once I get down to the soil/compact soil I am washing out much more often in turns. This is without applying any throttle. The front wheel feels lighter to me than the last Beta.

With that said, I love the new whip and the new suspension feels awesome!
Title: Re: MX Bikes beta14 - Phyiscs Poll
Post by: holtergeist on April 09, 2020, 05:40:00 AM
i just want to add that i enjoyed the more "free" and movable feeling of the rider in the previous beta. i feel like my rider lean is restricted and maybe a bit sluggish. of course, i have lost the front end here and there but it hasnt been a major issue for me. i would recommend  maybe adding some more details as to what the specific suspension settings do...other than just softer and more reaction.

i really do not like the engine feeling and overall feeling of the MSM models and i truly belive the next OEM's will make the latest updates come to life even more. at the same time, i also feel that if everything were to stay the same as they are right this second, it would eventually feel normal to me like beta 13 did.

the suspension and in air whips, with bike lock enabled or disabled, is a major major major improvement. I am overall happy with the update and i voted "better than before but still needs work" because i feel like this beta gave me a taste of what Piboso and friends can really bring to the game, since with beta13 i couldnt imagine how it would get better other than fixing rear end bounce. now i see where he is going and i like it.

everyone is entitled to there opinion but with certain arcade motocross games going to shit, i can only assume its from so much feedback from all ends of the spectrum. so with that being said i would encourage anyone playing to really think about what your criticism is for the game. is it you? have you just not become acclimated to the new changes? or do you really feel that negatively about it?

many aspects of how i feel are subject to change the more i play

also, i feel the terrain sound in sand and some dirt seems a bit cheesy to me. just seems off. also, i think it would be nice to be able to see a little bit more of the handlebars without feeling like you're in the riders chest. i want to feel like im eye level and the hand comes up to the screen when pulling tearoffs.

again, physics feel good but the rider seems a bit sluggish when using "rider lean" from left to right.
Title: Re: MX Bikes beta14 - Phyiscs Poll
Post by: PizzaChet on April 09, 2020, 03:28:55 PM
I still feel that there has always been something fundamentally wrong with the way the bike/tires interact with the ground. It still has never been fixed.
Title: Re: MX Bikes beta14 - Phyiscs Poll
Post by: Yirka63 on April 10, 2020, 02:06:26 PM
For me it is great improvement.

I am not good at talking about details I like while riding (real bike or game), but I really like new suspension - I can ride a lot faster then in previous betas. Bike feel heavier, before it was too powerful and light weight. Now it is great ratio between these two values.

I think this update was good improvement, the front wheel washing not seems like big problem for me - you need to be patient and taking berms and ruts carefuly.

Keep up the great work Piboso and team!!
Title: Re: MX Bikes beta14 - Phyiscs Poll
Post by: holtergeist on April 11, 2020, 01:47:04 AM
after even more playing, and yes with the MSM bikes, i truly feel that the update to physics is 100% good. again, and i know i say this alot, but to the people who are struggling with liking the newer physics, in beta13 did you use rider lean/rider forward/back often? i feel this update it is much more important to ride the bike "correctly". in motocross (im going to generalize here) when cornering, the rider is mostly only neutral on the bike when the wheels have something to support the bike like a rut or a berm. when cornering on flat or corners that do not give the bike support, most of the time the body is moving outward and putting weight on top of the bike. i think the physics changes are pushing the player to simulate this in game. i am honestly not having any real problems with the front end knifing and i can say that i fall quite a bit less than i did in beta 13 because the bike can get much lower in corners without that weird crash the game would give you sometimes. also, for the times i have knifed and fallen, i think my approach to the corner was incorrect, ive noticed myself leaning forward WHILE weighting the outside peg on flat corners and in ruts/berms ive been leaning back as well. and bike setup? i dont think ive even scratched the surface yet.

the ability to get over the bars and put the riders weight over the front end is much improved as well. not just on faces of jumps but for landings as well when you want to land say to flat and get over the front of the bike to accelerate.

i wonder if some of the issues people are having, and the things they dont like about the update is due to the MSM bikes and how they feel overall. and i say that because when i play beta 14 with the OEM bikes, i think every aspect of gameplay is much easier compared to 13 and i honestly dont see where the complaints are if people are (even tho we know we arent supposed to) judging the update based on OEM bikes.

assuming all complaints of front end knifing and physics issues are in fact based on experience with MSM bikes...i simply dont understand such comments referring to having to "learn the game over again" and things like that. i dont feel the physics change was enough for someone who has a "pro/pro am" skill level to even really have many complaints. i believe Piboso is trying to create a game where you have to use all aspects of control in order to ride fast and thats including rider lean left/right and forward backward. notice the rider animation improvement for leaning forward and backward.

lastly, i had to go back into my advanced settings for my inputs and change most of my settings compared to what i was running in beta13 and to me thats to be expected and makes sense. once i did that, i got my feel back and i felt right at home with the game again, allowing me to feel the physics changess and enjoy them.

for what its worth, i really hope nothing gets changed back towards what beta13 offered. in fact, ive debated changing my vote to "its perfect"....thats how much i like beta14.
Title: Re: MX Bikes beta14 - Phyiscs Poll
Post by: imlonng on April 15, 2020, 05:15:41 PM
Quote from: iNsane | WeekendWarriors on April 06, 2020, 02:54:57 PMI'll start as always

Option: Great Improvement

In my opinion and after riding the MSM 250xf for around 3 hours and playing around with the camera settings (both locked, unlocked; changing the FOV/pitch/...) I started to really like the new physics and bike behaviour in general. Whips feel awesome, the bouncyness got way better, if you case a jump you actually get punished for it and your front washes out/you fall. In b13c it was really forgiving if you case jumps but this wasn't the real deal, IMO.

Cornering feels great too, I still can try to drag bars but you have to get used to the fact that you can't rocket out of a corner anymore really. The grip has been a bit reduced which makes the game feel greatly better and more realistic. The usage of rider weight became a very important task to do when trying to get fast, this is great.

I am confused about the OEM bikes not working, I have Assen, so I believe the game is running in beta 14, but I am still able to use the OEM bikes with no issues? What am I missing here?
Title: Re: MX Bikes beta14 - Phyiscs Poll
Post by: iNsane on April 15, 2020, 05:24:51 PM
Sure you can use them but a lot of values have changed. Yet this is not the topic to ask for OEMs.
Title: Re: MX Bikes beta14 - Phyiscs Poll
Post by: Paradox28 on April 15, 2020, 05:35:41 PM
After having more time on the seat..the only thing that still bugs me is the over jump crashing. I fully expect to bottom out and feel like a brick after skying a big jump to flat but it seems that the margin of error may be just a bit too small, overall. I have figured out the front end deal and the more I ride, the more I notice things that are good and have been noticing myself thinking "that'd be a move you'd see/do on a real bike"
Title: Re: MX Bikes beta14 - Phyiscs Poll
Post by: Snappe on April 16, 2020, 06:19:34 PM
I find leaning back on landing helps with overjumps... Even better if you land nose-high and then lean back to soak up the impact