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Topics - Asdrael

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Bug Reports / Suspension settings
« on: July 12, 2018, 09:21:18 PM »
After trying several things with both stock and modified bikes, I have come to the conclusion that at least the rear shock settings don't work properly, if at all.

All tests done using MaxHUD suspension function with 1% setting for the bottoming out symbol, using stock 450f or several the OEM bikes (to make sure it wasn't a particular geometry causing it - they have the exact same suspension values in the cfg as the stock bikes).

- preload seems to function as it should
- spring rate seems to influence sag, but not as much as expected. Also barely influences compression an rebound behaviour.
- compression and rebound damping settings don't seem to do anything, or so little it is barely noticable.

An easy test is to try all extremes on an outdoor track. You'll bottom out your shock, whatever the setting, on the take off of most jumps. Even running a 60 spring rate and maxed out compression damping. As a test, I also modified the .cfg to double all values, and it still bottoms out.

So there is either an issue with the suspensions not calling the values in the .cfg, the garage not actually applying settings, or the values in the .cfg being way far off what they should be.

Bug Reports / BikeEd crash with new "flexible" model parts
« on: July 07, 2018, 07:51:56 PM »

it appears the currently available BikeEd version (using the link on this forum) cannot load a geometry attached to a model that has the new flexible components.

With the new Alta, BikeEd works fine until we try to load the flexible version - using the exact same geometry file.

Bug Reports / Direct Lean value changing when accessing setup window.
« on: November 27, 2017, 02:57:05 PM »
Noticed that the other day:

Your Direct Lean value will reduce by 1 each time you touch anything in your controller setup. Had it set at 100, and after messing with my settings, I realized it was at 88...

Reproducible easily - set it at a value, close it, open the setup again, fiddle with another value (may only work in the first page of the settings), validate, open the settings again, the Direct Lean will have gone down by 1.

Setups / Protip: "Linearity" in controller setup.
« on: November 27, 2017, 10:30:25 AM »
Quite a few people have been complaining lately about the front brake being too brutal and the throttle response (of 450s in particular) being too unforgiving, causing front end wash-out, spinning or looping out from the rear.

To what I reply: “lol noobs”.

More seriously, I think most people overlook their controller setup, in particular the “linearity” setting of their analog input. This controls how your controller input (CI) is translated into in game input (GI). Let me explain the linearity setting (when gain is at 100%):

What you always have:
  • CI of 0 = GI of 0 (no controller input = no game input)
  • CI of 1 = GI of 1 (max press on the controller = maximum game input. This is affected by the gain setting: with a gain of 75%, a CI of 1 = GI of 0.75…)
What linearity affects: everything in between.
  • A linearity of one will reproduce the CI directly to the GI with no modification. CI of 0.5 = GI of 0.5. Blue curve in the graph.
  • A high linearity value will put more strength in the first part of the controller input. For example, with a linearity of 150%, a CI of 0.5 = a GI of 0.75 (more or less). As a result, the end of the controller input range will have less effect. Green curve in the graph.
  • A low linearity value will lower the impact of the early movement range of the controller on game input. A linearity of 75% for example will give, for a CI of 0.5, a GI of 0.35 (or something). Red curve in the graph.

    Now what does that mean in game? Easy. With a low linearity, you’ll be able to feather more accurately the early response, at the cost of having a harder time being precise when going hard on the control. A high linearity does the opposite. I currently use around 75% both on front brake and throttle.

    Is it cheating? Nop. I’d even argue it’s more realistic. The controller range is rather small and provides close to zero feedback.

    For braking, you normally would gauge the braking power by the number of fingers you are using + the resistance you are feeling. The controller doesn’t provide that. By having a low linearity, I simulate the low resistance first part of the lever range. I don’t mind losing accuracy in the end of the range, as hard braking is normally done without any lean angle – and in that case it’s not semi-hard braking, it’s hard braking. But now I can control better how I ease on the brake going in the corner, with more accuracy and response than when simply using the “smoothing” parameter.

    For throttle, it’s the same reasoning. When you are griping a throttle, the range of movement is rather large – much more than a controller trigger. Doing a full 0 to 100% throttle on a bike is quite a movement for your wrist, you wouldn’t normally do it – at least not at the speed you can do it with a controller. As with braking, you usually need to be careful with the throttle in its early movement range (say 0-50%, when exiting turns or when its slippery) and when you go hard, you don’t go 80% hard. You go 100%.

    In the end, it solves a lot of issues that I think come from the lack of feedback and small movement range a controller has compared to IRL actions. Try it, you’ll be surprised… (Disclaimer: it won't solve shitty setups and hammering controls :p ).

General Discussion / Bug or feature? Deformation <-> Grip
« on: November 26, 2017, 11:40:48 AM »
We tested some stuff with TFC and Teeds, and since I have been focusing on "grip the last few days I can confirm this.

The Deformation setting of the server influences the overall Grip of the track.

Grip offline = grip with server deformation on 1.

Server deformation on 0.7: less grip. I think (correct me if I'm wrong) we tried with 0.2 but it didn't seem very different from 0.7. We rode quite a few laps on each setting, enough for deformation to kick in sufficiently to have comparable ruts.

Now that's an issue, since I suppose all parameters have been chosen offline, yet most of us like to use deformation settings below 1 online to avoid trenches.

(until we have more information on this I strongly encourage all hosts - thanks again for hosting - to use a deformation setting of 1).

Support / Server hosting modified bikes - client auto crash
« on: November 07, 2017, 07:42:50 PM »

Been slaving trying to figure out why the OEM wouldn't allow online play.

While a bracket was indeed missing in the sfx.cfg file of the 250 OEM, it didn't fix the issue.

Note: the mods were installed in the game folder old school style (not the new mod folder in C:/Documents/Piboso/...).

  • Configure dedicated server, from the same install folder as the client.
  • Start server with NO mods at all. Connect client --> works.
  • Start server with 1 bike I took randomly (tried RMZ450, FC350, YZF250 - untouched except for a fixed sfx.cfg when needed). Connect client --> works.
  • Start server with 2 bikes taken from the one working alone (ex: RMZ450+ FC350). Connect client --> crash.
It seems having more than 1 custom bike in the folder induces this crash. Not sure what else I can test to help now, let me know if I can do anything more.

(apologies for the server spam on the list, I was changing server name + port each time to make sure I had no conflict).

Edit: been given the advice by Vortex to clean up what I had left of "ghost" bikes and retry. On it atm.
Edit 2: references to temporary edf removed, no change. Still crashes.

Bikes / OEM pack - Master Thread - 06.12.2018 OEM v0.10.1 - Beta10 Springz
« on: November 05, 2017, 08:16:34 PM »
Here is a « master thread » for OEM. Easier for all to keep track.

06.12.2018 OEM v0.10.1 - Beta10, the revenge of the Springz

Probably the biggest OEM update so far, see the changelog for details. Spent over 30h on it. Shortly: Lean Help Off highlighted some pros of the OEM... and quite a few pitfalls that needed to be addressed. Hoh, and I had some ideas of stuff to try that turned out... pretty good ;) I'm still not 100% happy with the 450f, so trying stuff out again...

Server hosts: further categrory split. 2 strokes have their own categories now, check the changelog.

How to:
New users: dowload and unzip into your installation folder. That's it.

Download this pack from MEGA.NZ or MEDIAFIRE . 2.5+Gb so take your time. Unzip and put in your MXB directory, it contains a /bikes folder with all the OEM bikes released so far, updated for Beta9. Careful: those bikes are now unpacked (not in .pkz) because otherwise I always mess the updates up. The bikes can then be found in game in their own category: MX1 OEM and MX2 OEM for four strokes, MX1-2t OEM and MX2-2t OEM for 2 strokes. (server hosts: don't forget to enable those categories or put the server to Open if you want to allow those bikes).

Previous users: if you already had v0.9.1 here is a "patch download" with instructions

Download this smaller zip file -65kB- and install it in your game directory, accept the overwrite of all files: MEGA.NZ or MEDIAFIRE

Currently supported bike list:
  • Yamaha YZ 125, YZ 250, YZF 250 and YZF 450 2016.
  • Honda CRF 250R and CRF 450R 2018
  • Suzuki RM 125 and RM 250 2003 ; RMZ 250 and RMZ 450 2018
  • Kawasaki KXF 250 and KXF 450 2017
  • Husqvarna FC 250, FC 350 and FC 450 2016
  • Alta MX and MXR 2018
Change log: v0.10.1 – 06/12/2018
  • Categories changes: Split between four strokes ("MX1 OEM" and "MX2 OEM", same as before) and two strokes ("MX1-2t OEM" and "MX2-2t OEM", that's MXx minus 2 tee, no space, then space and OEM). Hopefully will reduce the issues of people not syncing, in particular if more 2 strokes get added. Server hosts beware! You can also have more than 1 category per server.
  • Collision boxes: adapted the new collision boxes to all bikes, and thightened them up.
  • Geometry changes: all bikes have had their rear end geometry revised. This is to allow the stock spring rate to be used with proper sag. Use "Default" setup in the garage.
  • Alta MX and MXR: new engine.
  • 2 stroke geometries: all 2 strokes had a small issue in their weight distribution. Now fixed. Should feel lighter overall, in particular from the front.
  • 2 stroke engines: all 2 strokes should now be a bit more brutal and behave more like 2 strokes (yes 125 and 250).
  • 450f: should now bit a bit less brutal and kick less in the lower RPM range.
  • CFG changes: all bikes have had the CFG files revised, fixed and updated as needed. From rev limiters, to stock preload, to whatever.
Enjoy and: Feedback very welcome, as usual. From now on, OEM pack will be updated on Thursday only, unless outstanding issues causing computers to spontaneously combust.
Bear with me if I messed something up, very tired those days ;)

Credits and original threads:
Former updates:

Code: [Select]
[b]Change log: v0.9.1 – 05/09/2018[/b]
[list][*][u]Gearbox changes:[/u] all bikes now have proper gearbox behaviour. Slightly let go of the throttle or slip the clutch to shift up. Values should work for all bikes, including 2 strokes.
[*][u]Shift Help:[/u] Should work properly for all bikes. Activate the option in your Simulation Settings if you cba to upshift like a man.
[*][u]450f engines:[/u] modified their inertia back to recommended values. Should now behave more like an oversized 250f (both engine and chassis wise), and not a completely different beast (had to revert because tyre + suspension changes now allow it to work).
[*][u]Geometry fine tunning:[/u] all bikes touched up. The placebo effect is strong.
[*][u]Alta:[/u] are now proper electric bikes. 1 gear -no need to switch anymore- a battery, etc. Had to cheat a bit to get it to work (see [url=]HERE[/url]). Primary Drive ratio updated - thanks Pibs!-
[*][u]CRF250:[/u] slightly changed the primary drive ratio. Should feel less sluggish.
[*][u]KXF450 and RMZ450:[/u] rev limiters updated.[/list]
[b]Change log: v0.8.3b – 26/07/2018[/b]
[list][*][u]Replaced[/u] the 2016 Suzuki 4 strokes with 2018 models. The RMZ 250 is basically the same as before, I however updated the dyno and tried to improve the geometry a bit.[/list]
[b][size=12pt]Enjoy and: Feedback very welcome, as usual. From now on, OEM pack will be updated on Thursday only, unless outstanding issues causing computers to spontaneously combust. [/size]And bear with me if I made any mistakes please, tired as hell these days :p[/b]
[b]Change log: v0.8.2 – 19/07/2018[/b]
[list][*]Each download has a text file containing some information, in particular latest version installed
[*][u]Replaced[/u] the 2017 Honda with 2018 models.
[*][u]Replaced[/u]the former Alta MXR by Alta MX and Alta MXR v2: The Alta MX can be found in MX2 OEM and has Eco, Sport and Performance maps. The Alta MXR can be found in MX1 OEM and has an extra map - Overclocked.
[*]ALL weight distribution of the bikes redone. I strongly encourage people to try them all again.
[*]The rider position on the 4 strokes has been reviewed.
[*]All default setups have thus been reviewed to what I find nice: Front sag 30/60, rear sag 40/105 approximately.[/list]
[size=12pt][b]Enjoy and: Feedback very welcome, as usual. From now on, OEM pack will be updated on Thursday only, unless outstanding issues causing computers to spontaneously combust.[/b] [/size]
[b]Change log: v0.8.1 – 28/16/2018[/b]
[list][*][u]Now using Stock tyres and suspensions.[/u] They are way better and I don't think I could come up with anything better not knowing how it works in detail anymore.
[*]All bikes should have less clutch slippage.
[*]The rev limiter should be less intrusive.
[*]Fuel consumption issue fixed - all bikes should last a full moto now.
[*]Sounds fixed - should now have more distinction between 125, 250, 250f and 450f (no new sounds though).
[*]All custom paints removed to limit the DL size. For all your fashion needs, visit the appropriate forum boards.[/list]
[size=12pt][b]Enjoy and: Feedback very welcome, as usual. From now on, OEM pack will be updated on Thursday only, unless outstanding issues causing computers to spontaneously combust.[/b] [/size][b]Change log: v0.7.3 – 25/11/2017[/b]
[list][*]New tyres: MX52 for medium-hard terrain, MX3S for medium-soft terrain (revised compared to previous versions). Stock tyres still available.
[*]Should be a bit easier to whip.
[*]Rider hands should now properly grip the bars.
[*]Rev limiter should be harder to hit consistently as long as the rear wheel is on the ground.[/list]

[b]Change log: v0.7.2 – 08/11/2017[/b]
[list][*]Fine tuned the MX52 front tyre. Except more surface differences and more realistic behaviour, in particular on soft terrain.
[*]Red RPM indicator fixed for all bikes.
[*]Temporary bike .edf removed to reduce size.
[*]Fixed a missing bracket in sfx for the MX2 OEM. Huehue. [/list]

[b]Change log: v0.7.1 – 05/11/2017[/b]
[list][*]All collision boxes and 1st person views homogenised between bikes.
[*]AeroX value adjusted for Beta7
[*]Suspensions are still the OEM ones, not the stock ones. Expect way less bounciness than stock.
[*]Choice of tyres: “Stock” are Piboso’s stock tyres for Beta7. “MX52” are my take on the Beta7 tyre model. Same grip to stock, but you should feel a bit more resistance from the terrain when losing said grip. [i]"Geo tyres" are now outdated and do not work with Beta7 new tyre format.[/i] [/list]

General Discussion / PSA: Clean install b7 -No OEM bikes till update
« on: November 04, 2017, 09:36:29 PM »
As the title says.

when updating to Beta7, do a clean install as explained here: otherwise you'll get issues.

The OEM bikes are currently NOT gonna work with Beta 7. The tyre format changed and I need to update every bike to call for the proper tyres (+ other misc values change).

Suggestions and wishlist / Sand fluffiness and deformation.
« on: April 20, 2017, 09:16:06 PM »
So, we were trying Southwick "clean" with a few people tonight to check out a deformation idea that seems to work well. Testing was done with OEM bikes and Geo tyres, wround 5 people for 1h30min.

What we noticed is that sand feels "gravel hard" without deformation but it's bearable.

The problem is that with deformation, the ruts become rock solid and it's very difficult to navigate: the deformation of sand is fast (like it should), fairly thin (the ruts could imo be broader and not as sharp on the edge in sand) - you end up with trenches that catch your wheel brutally.

Is it planned to soften up the sand so it's "fluffy"? If should feel like you are sinking in, which is not the case now. I don't think this can be currently modified in the tyre file though (or at least I don't know where).

Off Topic / The random YouTube Channel thread
« on: March 28, 2017, 09:49:52 PM »
Random thread of the day - post here when you find a channel you can't get enough of on the Tube.

Only rules: post the channel, post your personnal highlight.

My personnal random favorite: Life of Boris.

Just a Slav guy going about Slav things. Hilariously.

<a href="" target="_blank" class="new_win"></a>

Bikes / General OEM feedback
« on: March 25, 2017, 01:16:11 PM »

Yeah, so, erm, I know I said I wasn't going to do all bikes as OEM but it turns out I did. Blame the shitty weather and boredom. As far as I know, there are no major flukes in the OEM bikes. All have been done the same way, following manufacturer's data, and have been out for some time now. A few things have been done following my own judgment (450f engine inertia and braking torque, 2 strokes engines, some chassis value for data missing here and there), but I would say nothing major.

Most importantly, I think every OEM in every category is competitive (except 2 strokes vs 4 strokes but that's realistic I guess). I can take any 250f and run 1:09 in SX2016Rd01, which is decent. To go lower, I need to find "my" bike and work on it, which is the way it should be I think.

I know from some people I have talked to that they stick to OEM bikes now (much love guys <3). But after some time playing them, what's your feedback in general?

- Does anything seem completly out or wierd?
- Any bike stupidly more / less competitive than other in your view, and if so, how?
- Have you found stuff that should be included that I overlooked?
- Have you had the chance to ride any bike in a comparative way IRL and any realism comments?
etc etc.

(for now, OEM are going to stay in their own category because of 1. tyres, and 2. making it easier for server and race hosts to select which kind of bikes they want).

Hey, thought I would compile all the suggestions regarding online play in one topic and attempt to keep it updated. I would say each section is in order of priority.

Server selection and interface

Server information text/link box
Server hosts should be able to add text to the server information to point people to a pack download.

Server display with/without track
Need a way to see a server even if we don't have the track it's running. Suggested a color code for the servername.

Current players name display
Would be nice if we could see who is playing on the server before connecting, to speed up the process of finding friends.

Friend list
... and down the road, have a kind of friend list which highlights servers in green when your friends are on it.

Voting system

Remove people not voting from the 2/3 voting count
A LOT of people go afk randomly, and it tends to block the votes. We need people not present to not count in the number of votes. Make the 2/3 of yes rule for votes casted only.

More voting options
On the top of my head:
  • !vote drm : to reset deformation
  • !set drmX: sets deformation value, giving a possibility to work up a track with deformation high and then freeze it.
  • A kind of next track voting system.
    • !list tracks: displays the list of tracks on the server in order with their number
    • !vote nexttrack / !vote trackX: to move the server to the next track or trackX in the rotation. Also needed: jump clients with the server, don't kick them out.

During online play

Let people join the server during a Race
Don't prevent people from joining, but allow them to join as Spectator only and delay their bike load (or see next point).

People joining use your bike at first
Have people joining a server use YOUR OWN bike ghost and not their bike ghost to prevent the load lag. Complete model loading happens in the Garage, as it is now.

Setups / Setup extras: Fork Offset and Swing Arm Length
« on: March 19, 2017, 12:52:01 PM »
So we have a good suspension setup guide from Stonerider found here:

... but why is noone talking about ForkOffset and Swing Arm Length?

Those two settings have, in my experience with OEM bikes, the most influence on the actual front and rear end behaviour of the bike - their combination resuting in drastic changing in feel and balance.

Those settings can be found in the Garage / Others tab / Geometry section.

Fork offset.

It's the distance between the fork and the steering axis. Most bikes have a default value between 22 and 25mm stock. Your offset value adds/removes from that. A 2mm change is already pretty big - 10%.

Decreasing this distance by putting a negative OffSet value generally:
  • Shifts the bike weight to the front, increasing front grip, decreasing rear grip.
  • Increases bike handling, giving a feeling of more controlled and sharper turning
If you find your chosen bike a big slugish with a fuzzy front end, go with -2 and that'll do wonders. Conversly, if you feel the rear end goes everywhere and only the front is reliable, +1 or 2 will change that.

Swing Arm Length.

This is the distance between the Swing Arm pivot point and the rear axle. A standard swingarm is around 590mm. The range of change is around 30mm. There are three positions: middle (1), short (0) and long (2).

A longer swingarm:
  • Shifts bike weight to the front
  • Tends to lessen any excessive wheelie issue
  • Increases turn radius
  • Gives a bit of a sluggish feeling when turning
  • Makes the rear less twitchy when powersliding - the rear wheel will not move as much
  • Makes the rear more mobile twitchy when it starts moving while breaking hard from the front
If you find you are losing the rear uncontrollably, try to go with a longer swingarm. Conversly, if you feel the bike is very rear heavy, a setting of 0 will help. Do not forget that changing the SwingArm Length changes how the rear shock is linked to the wheel! You will need to adjust your preload!

Setting interaction.

As you can see, the impact of some SwingArm settings overlap with the Fork Offset settings. But not all. So you can really impact the behaviour of the bike this way, and a chassis you don't gel with but love the engine off can be quite extensively modified to suit your style better.

Generally, a change of 1 step in swingarm length changes the weight distribution as much as 2 steps in fork offset.

As a rule of thumb, this is valid only when your suspension are properly tuned. A change in offset / length will never stop a fork from bottoming out, or a shock from being too hard and making you lose grip because it skims over terrain. Set you sag, get a good ballpark of Bump/Rebound values. THEN change fork offset and swingarm length. You will maybe fine tune the suspension again afterwards, but you'll be at least working in the right direction.

Hope that helps!

Bug Reports / beta6 bug list
« on: March 17, 2017, 10:38:17 AM »
Going to try to keep a beta6 bug list updated. Feel free to contribute, document properly if possible. That means:
- description of the bug (what it is, where / how it happens)
- how to reproduce it


Gravity not affecting other players fully
- When jumping, even is all is fine for your own bike and rider, it appears that other players are not affected by gravity fully (I'd say they have half). They jump, fly high and far but with a normal trajectory. When they land on their computer (which is, for other players, still way high almost at apex), their bike warps back to the ground.
- Seen and reproduced anytime, any ping, online with everyone. Might be linked to the distance to the other player (very close is smooth, a few meters away it starts being choppy).

Stock bike mismatch
Some people have reported that with a fresh install, trying to join a stock server (no mods running), they get "bike mismatch".
Not reproducible nor predictable (?)
Afaik, Teeds had it but retrying without changing anything let him through, Mattias has it, no idea if fixed.

Bandwidth Setting
It appears the Low setting on the bandwidth parameters provides a smoother multiplayer movement. Placebo? Tried with Philian, it felt smoother with Low rather than high.

Multiplayer loading
It feels like people logging on will cause the same "loading lag" whether they log on a server with a new bike or a bike already present and loaded on the server. Multiple loading of the same model (possibly justifies why people core like hell above a certain number of players).


Setting resets
For some people, the bike setup sometime bugs out and doesn't load, giving a value of 1 everywhere.


Landing seated bug
Remnant from beta 5. When you jump higher than a meter, if you land while sitting a tad to fully on the back, you auto dismount 90% of the time. Even when landing soft as a feather.

Seen last night in SX: way too many laps run on the same track, at one point at a heavily rutted location, a spike appeared. It is similar to what you get when you change the heightmap without resetting deformation when creating a track and trying it out in game. It looks like a fez pixels of the heightmap assign themselves the maximum height value. Never seen it playing solo.

Deformation is not continuous between 2 different materials, even if the masks used overlap with a transparency gradient. The ruts stop pretty abruptly and give a wierd kick when you ride over them. Example on FTT, transition between Soft Soil and Sand (see left side):

Track Editing / Blender: "Dropping" objects onto the heightmap
« on: March 05, 2017, 08:33:13 PM »

any blender pro to explain to me how to easily lay object onto a heightmap?

I know already how to import and scale properly a heightmap so it becomes a proper 3D object I can use as a reference to place objects. But I'm NOT tuning X,Y, Z and rotation for every toughblock... Any idea? I'd use sketchup but my trial version ran out and I would like to use more things from blender.

This ain't gonna toughblock itself :(

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