Riding Crossed Up!

[Wedgewood]

In an attempt to go faster through turns I started using manual lean L/R instead of autolean L/R and noticed that I can corner much faster when manually leaning into turns.  After comparing replay's between manual lean and autolean I've noticed that autolean makes the rider ride "crossed up" (leaning to the outside instead of the inside of the turn) through most of the corners.  The only time I've seen the rider actually lean into the turn was at the halfway point through a berm but only for a split second before he went back to riding crossed up.  I understand that for very slow maneuvers it may be best to counterweight or ride crossed up but at the speeds that we race it would be beneficial to have the rider lean into the turn rather than away from it.  I feel like this is why the bikes feel so reluctant to make tight turns.  Has anyone else noticed this and find this to be a problem?

[BadStar]

Interesting.. Naturally you want to stay on top of the bike to keep traction..sounds like the animation is accurate with auto lean but maybe its throwing off the simulation in some way.. I never ride with auto on so I am not sure. May test it some time

[Wedgewood]

I have a few screenshots to show this but not sure how to post them

[Wedgewood]

These photos were taken at the first turn in Paletta.  The first photo shows manual lean with the rider leaning into the turn as he should, and the second photo shows auto lean with the rider leaning to the outside of the turn (crossed up). 

[𝖙𝖋𝖈]

Maybe I'm wrong but isn't the first screenshot more of a road bike stance?

[pacopastor34]

Maybe I'm wrong but isn't the first screenshot more of a road bike stance?

totally

[Asdrael]

Leaning more than the bike is used very rarely in MX, at least not for a whole turn. You can use your body to try to pivot the bike faster but no way you'll be doing that the whole turn. You'd wash out.

Typically you turn with your "inside butt-cheek" on the seat, which is the opposite of road-bike turns where you have your outside butt-cheek on the seat.

Villopotto training on SX turns:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gDNd8Uw16lQ

He is getting like 10-15° less angle than his bike on a perfectly groomed bowl turn, on which you can gauge the adherence fairly well and push it. There is even more angle difference in a MX rut.

[Wedgewood]

Yes the first screenshot is definitely more of a road race stance,  however with this stance it seems to give much more traction, stability and corner speed vs. counter leaning which is the proper way to ride motocross bikes.  I can go into a turn later and still pass my ghosts and come out of the turn with much more speed.  IRL this method may cause a wash out however it seems to have the opposite effect in this game. 

[Wedgewood]

It could be a physics problem,  or maybe its just in my head.  Could one of you guys give it a try and see if you find the same thing?

[𝖙𝖋𝖈]

but I'm not sure he should be leaning into the turn like that.. Maybe sometimes for a quick 180 corner in and out people lean in slightly to force a tighter turn angle at the apex but on a normal railed corner your weight would be outside rather than inside even if only slightly surely?

[BadStar]

Thats exactly what I was saying.. on mx style riding, you put your weight on top of the bike, so really you sit on the seat and a little on the side facing away from the turn. Like asdrael said, you would wash out leaning into a turn like that for the most part.

So the Auto lean animation looks more accurate, but maybe it is causing a physics conflict...or your not leaning the right way on manual. With the game working proper on manual lean, with a right hand turn you should be trying to sit on top which would look like your leaning left kind of and pushing the handle bars down to the ground. IMO the 1st person animation look very real, left hand turn - you can see your left arm extend (pushing) the bars down..which in turn is (counter steeering).

so point being - if the bike handles better leaning into the turn than the physics need tweaking