beta6 bug list

[teeds]

I can understand it if it only happens when you send it and flat land from a big jump, that's to be expected to some degree IRL, a human can only take so much impact. It's only the landing without overshooting on a down slope with the rear wheel down that's annoying me. I will try again tonight but yesterday I could not get the example I mentioned on Winchester to occur on the stock 250 at all and I had the rear wheel way down. With an MX2 OEM bike it seemed that with even a sniff of rear down on the same jump I was off, haven't tried any others yet.

[𝖙𝖋𝖈]

I guess I should have explained a bit more but was on my phone.. It was the only situation that I thought was easily describeable, it also happens if I don't overshoot and do it. Hell, I can be coming down the hill at Paleta (after the step up, 180 corner) at a relitively low speed, dip the back wheel too much and I'll instantly come off.

[Wedgewood]

in real life, in mid air, you can't lean forward without pulling the handlebars back. If you are on the ground or shall we say stand still, then you can lean forward or back without pulling or pushing the fron end. This is not a bug. This not a mistake either. This just how it would have to.

+1 for the above.

The rear brake tap however could use a little bit more effect when looping out and of course the auto clutch is horible. When you use your rear brake, whether mid air or on the ground, automatic the clutch is held until you hit the throttle again coz your bike will continue to run freewheel. Looping out could be compensated by tapping the rear brake (of course everyone knows) but the bike always goes clutch-engage and lose engine braking.

Just use manual clutch no ?

What went wrong? Was my landing so bad?

check this video out. thanks!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QVzRBjinZzE&feature=youtu.be

Landing hard on the rear, suspension bottoming out, force impulse being transmitted to the rider, rider legs/arm springs not soaking it up enough ==> rider "core" sees an instant g force above its max threshold and separates from the bike. That what I'd put my money on, if really obliged to

That seems to be the case but the rider really should ragdoll on top of the bike but still land with the wheels rolling, also when the rider falls it shouldn't automatically remove all grip from the bike.  Maybe a proper reaction would be for the rider to splat on top the the tank maybe hit his head on the bars,  hands and feet slip off of he controls, the bike continue to roll forward unable to get rider inputs for few seconds as the rider repositions himself.

[Wedgewood]

I decided to ride in 3rd person to watch the rider movement, and noticed something that could be making it tough to muscle the front end down. Even with my F/B liniarity at 200, the F/B movement seems to be pretty slow, which would make it tough to time while jumping and give less effect to that motion. It seems like steering is linear, but L/R lean and F/B are a much slower rate. Any thoughts?

If you play with the controls.txt doc you can map rider lean to happen faster and with less stick movement even when the settings screen won't allow it.  I've done this before to have L/R and F/B lean max out at just half stick deflection and also significantly sped up the inputs.  This made a huge difference to control, but when certain settings are changed it will overwrite these custom settings back to default.  I've since forgot which parameters I had to change to get the effect but with a little trial and error it shouldn't be hard to figure out. 

[Asdrael]

Regarding the dismount bug, and the potential differences between mod bikes and stock - I'd be really interested if anyone had some "hard" data on that. Like Bike X does it 4x more often than MSM. While I do not think it's related to suspensions bottoming out directly (or in general actual bike geometry), there is a good possibility that it's coming from the bike / rider or bike / bike collision boxes coming in contact at a certain speed or angle. That we can move and see if it changes anything (it's in the .geom file iirc). I wouldn't be surprised if it was the wheel collision meeting the fender collision or fender / rider for example.

[teeds]

If I get anything worth showing i'll make a vid of it now I've found what seems to be high failure point.

[Bj Slice]

Here is another short replay for rear wheel issue.

It should've been a better landing.

Anyway, please watch let's see what you guys say. Thanks!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-fRtpmrfN3I&feature=youtu.be

[𝖙𝖋𝖈]

Exactly this BJ, it was a hard landing, overshot a bit, but nothing a little back wheel first shouldn't fix. I've overshot that landing quite a few times and stayed on.

Further more, people who come up short on laroccos leap crash badly, I've come up short plenty of times on mxb and it's never caused a crash. You can land some insane stuff as long as both wheels come down at the same time.

[Bj Slice]

It could have been a hard landing if it was flat, but there was still a slope and I got forward momentum so I should have just landed it safely. Plus the jump was not too high compared to my last video. I have landed on that spot many times without crashing but it's just so weird when you have your rear wheel to land first.I have 2 more replays but it will make no differnce as I have the same results so why bother posting them right? Anyway, I hope landing gets better. irl you can land this kind of jump even though the wheels are not so even at ground contact.

Perfect example are these videos for this topic

https://youtu.be/hGw4BUxRkXY
https://youtu.be/6qSY42Zb0lg

[𝖙𝖋𝖈]

That first video also demonstrates how leaning forward dips the back end nicely

[teeds]

That first video also demonstrates how leaning forward dips the back end nicely

I don't see that TFC? You can see he starts the jump nose up and then lets off the throttle and pulls the clutch, then hits the rear brake to bring the nose down so he can rev the bike again for the landing, so he can be on the power when the rear wheel contacts the dirt again (which helps reduce the impact). He didn't lean forward or back, it just looks that way due the bike moving.

[𝖙𝖋𝖈]

That first video also demonstrates how leaning forward dips the back end nicely

I don't see that TFC? You can see he starts the jump nose up and then lets off the throttle and pulls the clutch, then hits the rear brake to bring the nose down so he can rev the bike again for the landing, so he can be on the power when the rear wheel contacts the dirt again (which helps reduce the impact). He didn't lean forward or back, it just looks that way due the bike moving.

And you have to do the same in MXB to get the same result.. Just leaning forward and backward without gassing or braking doesn't do nearly as much as leaning appropriately with brake / throttle and a good trajectory like in the video.

[𝖙𝖋𝖈]

Exactly geo. If a camera was fixed to a pole from the side of a bike facing the rider, it would appear that the rider is leaning forward and backward, where in fact while the rider is leaning, it's more of a natural balancing act, 2nd nature to stay upright.

Since mxb doesn't do this, and might never, it's up to us to simulate it. I find it becomes 2nd nature though, don't really give it a second thought.

[CSchmied986]

Most people do not understand is that when you hit the break/ throttle in the air, you are actually effecting the front wheel very little. Hitting the rear break in the air does not bring the front end down, it bring the rear end up, and the opposite goes for the throttle.

Also, what is up with the effects of tyre compounds? Going from Hard to Soft makes the bike feel like you're riding in quick sand. It costs a ton of power which is far from realistic. Compounds are supposed to improve traction depending on the track surface, but in game it will let you corner better on any track, but makes it feel like you are riding with a blown top end in a straight line. The tyres could not weigh more than several ounces different, so the soft should be faster in a straight line, not slower. Something wrong there. 

[Asdrael]

Most people do not understand is that when you hit the break/ throttle in the air, you are actually effecting the front wheel very little. Hitting the rear break in the air does not bring the front end down, it bring the rear end up, and the opposite goes for the throttle.

So if I hit rear break then front brake then rear brake I'll reach the moon? No, hitting the rear brakes makes the front end go down.

Also, what is up with the effects of tyre compounds? Going from Hard to Soft makes the bike feel like you're riding in quick sand. It costs a ton of power which is far from realistic. Compounds are supposed to improve traction depending on the track surface, but in game it will let you corner better on any track, but makes it feel like you are riding with a blown top end in a straight line. The tyres could not weigh more than several ounces different, so the soft should be faster in a straight line, not slower. Something wrong there. 

I think it's just a temporary solution until Geo figures out better what every little value does and we can start looking into adding different tyre shapes etc. And the roll resistance doesn't have that much to do with the weight of the tyre, much more with the pattern and compound. For now, trading traction for "power" seems like an ok compromise.