Track editing

[AWood]

AWood, why are you so against encryption? If you want to distribute your heightmaps models and textures, why not just make them available to download seperately? It's understandable that some people might want to have their work protected.

I guess but I don't think it's a necessity. I will still try to release my stuff publicly if I can. I like to share and help the community thrive.

[bearded4glory]

Encryption is a touchy subject for a lot of people coming from Sim.  Its hard to say what the best method is, people are generally good about asking to use things that were released publicly and then there is nothing to rip.  On the other hand its hard to give away what you worked so hard on for people to potentially use without asking and if they dont know what they are doing it can not turn out that great.  I have looked into track making for GP-Bikes and the Kart Sim a little bit and it seems like they will be similar in many ways to MX-Bikes.  It looks like a lot of the files get exported to proprietary file formats, not sure exactly how it will work but seems like it will keep a little protection at least.  Also, with the amount of learning we are all going to be doing for a new way of doing everything I bet there will be a lot less people making tracks, at least for now.

SAFs were nice for keeping a pack of stuff contained and easy to organize in sim, something similar may be nice for that reason but with enough work any encryption that a game can read in under a second can be undone.

[JamieT]

AWood, why are you so against encryption? If you want to distribute your heightmaps models and textures, why not just make them available to download seperately? It's understandable that some people might want to have their work protected.

I'm glad you understand   I take then, that there will be file encryption for heightmaps, models and textures?

Back to my other questions... How many layers of terrain textures will be supported?  What are the supported heightmap resolutions?  Will we able to create a non-square shaped terrain, eg. 2049 x 1025?  If not, and the heightmaps are squares only, will there be support for multiple terrain tiles?

[JamieT]

SAFs were nice for keeping a pack of stuff contained and easy to organize in sim, something similar may be nice for that reason but with enough work any encryption that a game can read in under a second can be undone.

Unfortunately, SAFs weren't encrypted.  There were, as you say, just a way to keep everything organised.  Nothing in MXS was encrypted until the .scram files came along.  It is true that any encryption can be un-done, but trying to reverse a decent encryption can be a very lengthy process, that most people wouldn't have a clue where to start, therefore they don't bother.

[PiBoSo]

AWood, why are you so against encryption? If you want to distribute your heightmaps models and textures, why not just make them available to download seperately? It's understandable that some people might want to have their work protected.

I'm glad you understand   I take then, that there will be file encryption for heightmaps, models and textures?

Back to my other questions... How many layers of terrain textures will be supported?  What are the supported heightmap resolutions?  Will we able to create a non-square shaped terrain, eg. 2049 x 1025?  If not, and the heightmaps are squares only, will there be support for multiple terrain tiles?

There is no limit in the number of layers.
There is no limit in the heightmap resolution, but 2048x2048 is probably the max "practical" value.
The terrain must be square and have power of 2 size.

[bearded4glory]

SAFs were nice for keeping a pack of stuff contained and easy to organize in sim, something similar may be nice for that reason but with enough work any encryption that a game can read in under a second can be undone.

Unfortunately, SAFs weren't encrypted.  There were, as you say, just a way to keep everything organised.  Nothing in MXS was encrypted until the .scram files came along.  It is true that any encryption can be un-done, but trying to reverse a decent encryption can be a very lengthy process, that most people wouldn't have a clue where to start, therefore they don't bother.

Well SAFs were hard enough for me not to get into them and most of the community.  I do understand what you are saying and like I said it is a touchy subject.  It seems like you have always been worried about your terrains getting ripped but I don't think there is a single report of that happening.  There have been some instances of people using a old version of a track as a base for a new version just for the natural topography of the location but typically one would (and should) ask first.

With the amount of work it is going to take for people to learn to make MX-Bikes tracks vs. MX Sim tracks I think that the track guys over here will be of a more respectful variety.  It is a more involved process and generally the people who have spent the time to learn the ins and outs of a system like this are less likely to rip your work because they can do it themselves.  On the other hand we may see some tracks made for MX-B be ripped and put into MXS, only time and a alpha version will tell if they ride similarly enough to even be worth ripping though.

I dont know exactly how the system will work for objects (not sure if anyone does it seems like a WIP still) but it seems like track objects will have to be shared between different people as 3ds models or objs or whatever.  This may limit the sharing of objects between people so I could see a new file type that is not convertible back to an editable format (similar to JMs from Sim although I know it is possible to get a OBJ out of it) may be good for track objects.  Not sure if this is already in place or not.

[DD]

With the game itself being so modifiable, I don't see why protection for user created content would be necessary. If you don't want other people to have something, don't give it to anybody. Right?

[DD]

SAFs were nice for keeping a pack of stuff contained and easy to organize in sim, something similar may be nice for that reason but with enough work any encryption that a game can read in under a second can be undone.

Exactly. Saf files in MXS were never intended to keep work safe anyways. They were simply an organization tool that made it easy to pack things together. It just so happened that the average MXS/computer user didn't have the knowledge to be able to unpack them. But with a little bit of effort, even a person with basic computer knowledge could see how it worked.

[JamieT]

...

Yeah JMs weren't encrypted either...   Like SAFs, you can open the file in notepad, and all the information is there.  You might not understand the information instantly, but it is still human readable, and doesn't take long to work out.

Well, there were a few times where I had people send me tracks they'd apparently made for Reflex.  It was only later on that someone pointed out to me that the heightmap was taken from an MXS track.  Heightmaps can be ported across to any game quite easily.  The only difference seems to be how the terrain textures are made.  MXS uses a ton of decals, where as MX Bike will use masking layers which are applied to a tileable texture - just like MVA Reflex.

With the game itself being so modifiable, I don't see why protection for user created content would be necessary. If you don't want other people to have something, don't give it to anybody. Right?

You understand the concept of plagarism right?  Encrypted files takes absoloutly nothing away from people being able to ride and enjoy the track.  The only thing it takes away is being able to easily open up the track in order to edit it, or re-use elements that the creator has worked hard to create.  If the creator wishes it to be open for public use, then they're free to share those files.  Most game files are encrypted to some degree.  MXS is actually in the minority.

[DD]

With the game itself being so modifiable, I don't see why protection for user created content would be necessary. If you don't want other people to have something, don't give it to anybody. Right?

You understand the concept of plagarism right?  Encrypted files takes absoloutly nothing away from people being able to ride and enjoy the track.  The only thing it takes away is being able to easily open up the track in order to edit it, or re-use elements that the creator has worked hard to create.  If the creator wishes it to be open for public use, then they're free to share those files.  Most game files are encrypted to some degree.  MXS is actually in the minority.

Yes, I understand the concept of plagiarism. However, plagiarism is a much, much, much fuzzier line in 2014 than it was in... let's say 1974. Thanks to the internet of course. As a content creator myself I understand that the biggest frustration is having people claim your work as there own, or even worse, having someone that doesn't know what they are doing mess it up and make you look bad in return. But in my mind the problem is beyond that. I don't feel the need to get into detail about my own personal beliefs, so I won't, but you do make a valid point.

[al167]

for track making it would be good to have individual start gate locations, and maybe joker lane capabilities so we can make tracks like the monster energy cup
www.youtube.com/embed/cIYOTwfRimY
heres this same track that I made for reflex.
www.youtube.com/embed/Sanpgdh_eik

[Snappe]

al167 your track looks fantastic! Very nice work.
I guess the split start and joker lane is a one-off layout for this event?
7:30- 8:00 of that race is epic 

[giopanda]

This is how the beginning of a track looks like:

Code Select Expand


samples_x = 2049
samples_z = 2049
data = maryland.raw

size_x = 500
size_z = 500
scale = 20
pos_x = 0
pos_y = 0
pos_z = 0


X+ is right, Y+ is up and Z+ is forward.
samples_x and samples_z must be the same value and must be power of 2 + 1.
"scale" is the measure of the heightmap max value.
"pos" is the position in space of the bottom-left corner.
Everything is in meters.

so what i understand from that is:
2049x2049 is the size of the heightmap
500x500 is the size of the terrain in meters (so in this case the resolution of the heightmap is 4.098 pixel per meter, right?)
scale 20 means that the difference in height from pure black to pure white in the heightmap is 20 meters

and what about the 'position in space of the bottom left corner'?
you mean a real life geographical position of the southwest corner of the terrain?
so even elevation above sea level is taken into account?

please tell me i understood it correctly!

i'm very curious to know because i have a few replica tracks from mxsimulator ready to be converted and i might get them ready before even seeing the game!

track editor?
never used one in my life!
as some of you know i made some pretty decent replica tracks in mxsim, used in the 'official' championships, and i never did anything with the in-game track editor.
all i need is photoshop, blender, earth sculptor and notepad++
so not to be rude, but if people can't combine those elements together they probably better just play the game instead of creating for the game.
totally agree with showtime here, the less the better, a user friendly track editor doesn't attract more people, it just clutter the intrawebs with childish and poorly made stuff.


as far as file encryption and stuff, who knows me already probably remember my anti-piracy crusade and how much i fought about encryption and ripping on mxsim forums, and i'm still thinking the same.
file encryption is needed!
and the reason is pretty simple: protect our long waited and hard gained release.
i don't have anything to hide, i don't feel like i'm the best so no one can touch my stuff, it's just simply because i don't like to spend countless hours, countless sleepless nights (yes it took me 5 months to release my first redbud replica, working on it every night for at least 5 hours every night -you do the math-, not to mention the thor skin pack showtime mentioned in another thread) to see my work being completely wasted by some kid that does it just for fun and just for the sake of being a smartass and showing off he's able to rip protected files..come on what's the point?
that's what ruin the passion we creators put in modding a game, spending so much of our time, working hard and for free to release something to make others in the community happy to get back what?
this is lack of respect.
what i wanted to release 'open' and accessible to anyone i did it, but i don't see the point of releasing a track in an open folder, there's no point..
so why don't piboso release his games with completely open and accessible file to anyone to tweak and fiddle around?
it's the same exact core concept.

with all of this being said, don't start hating me, i'm just sick and tired of the situation that was running all over mxsim forums.
all i ask is respect for everyone, creators or not.

[PiBoSo]

This is how the beginning of a track looks like:

Code Select Expand


samples_x = 2049
samples_z = 2049
data = maryland.raw

size_x = 500
size_z = 500
scale = 20
pos_x = 0
pos_y = 0
pos_z = 0


X+ is right, Y+ is up and Z+ is forward.
samples_x and samples_z must be the same value and must be power of 2 + 1.
"scale" is the measure of the heightmap max value.
"pos" is the position in space of the bottom-left corner.
Everything is in meters.

so what i understand from that is:
2049x2049 is the size of the heightmap
500x500 is the size of the terrain in meters (so in this case the resolution of the heightmap is 4.098 pixel per meter, right?)
scale 20 means that the difference in height from pure black to pure white in the heightmap is 20 meters

and what about the 'position in space of the bottom left corner'?
you mean a real life geographical position of the southwest corner of the terrain?
so even elevation above sea level is taken into account?

please tell me i understood it correctly!

Everything is correct.
Elevation above sea level is set in another way.
Position is there just in case, for example to match an existing 3D model, but it's unlikely someone will need to change it from 0,0,0

[giopanda]

oh yes piboso that's just great!
can't wait to release thunder valley and see how the bike performs in the mile high track!